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Old 10-18-2010, 08:24 AM
 
Location: Full Time: N.NJ Part Time: S.CA, ID
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when did this turn into a healthcare debate?

 
Old 10-18-2010, 08:59 AM
 
28,163 posts, read 25,340,577 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LeavingMassachusetts View Post
If you are okay waiting to see an oncologist for 6 months while you have already been diagnosed with cancer, more power to you.

How many things has the government destroyed? And you think this is going to be a good thing? It scares the crap out of me.
I am ok with things being equal, yes. My life isn't any more important than anyone else's. How selfish.
 
Old 10-18-2010, 09:10 AM
 
1,302 posts, read 1,808,275 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Magritte25 View Post
I am ok with things being equal, yes. My life isn't any more important than anyone else's. How selfish.
Selfish? If you want to call it that, go ahead. Wait until your child is sick and you cannot get treatment. Maybe 6 months of watching your baby suffer will help you see differently.

It has nothing to do with someones life being more important. It has to do with being a productive member of society and doing your part in your own health and quality of life. It is not my job to feed and clothe your family and it is not my job to provide your healthcare. A child's healthcare, yes? A deadbeat who doesn't work? McDonalds is hiring. They offer benefits too.
 
Old 10-18-2010, 10:38 AM
 
Location: Northern Virginia
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My coworker pays a little over over $2k per month to put his 2 year old in day care. That's $25,000 a year just so that his daughter has a place to go during the day. It's a standard chain place, nothing fancy or over the top from what he tells me.

I think a comfortable level of income for us to have a couple kids would be around $150k. We have no family in the area to babysit for free, so we'd be paying over $25k per year to put the two kids in day care. Both of us make equal amounts of money, so one of us quitting isn't an option or we'd be in big trouble financially.

Then there'd be plane tickets across the country for 4 of us to visit family for holidays. College fund contributions for two. (I find it odd that people say those who can't support their children without government help shouldn't have kids, but those who take government grants or scholarships for college are okay--I think parents should plan to be able to pay for both).

Braces and glasses and specialist appointments would pile on expenses as well (as they're all but genetically guaranteed to have bad vision and teeth and allergies and such). We'd also need to move to a decent school district, which would be much more expensive housing. Right now we're happy to live in an urban area for good commute times, but that wouldn't be true any more. The cost of a 1950's 3 bedroom town home in a safe area with good schools starts around 450k here.

Clothes and food are minimal expenses in the scheme of things. Job losses and unforeseen expenses happen, but that doesn't mean that you should forego all planning.

It's telling that my friends and coworkers are all mid 20's-30's, and only 1 has a child. We're all trying to figure out how to make it work.
 
Old 10-18-2010, 12:26 PM
 
28,163 posts, read 25,340,577 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LeavingMassachusetts View Post
Selfish? If you want to call it that, go ahead. Wait until your child is sick and you cannot get treatment. Maybe 6 months of watching your baby suffer will help you see differently.

It has nothing to do with someones life being more important. It has to do with being a productive member of society and doing your part in your own health and quality of life. It is not my job to feed and clothe your family and it is not my job to provide your healthcare. A child's healthcare, yes? A deadbeat who doesn't work? McDonalds is hiring. They offer benefits too.
Waiting is better than not having. I speak from personal experience. When McDonald's hires people who are wayyyyyyyyy over qualified AND gives time off for doctors appointments and surgeries, let me know!
 
Old 10-18-2010, 12:46 PM
 
1,302 posts, read 1,808,275 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Magritte25 View Post
Waiting is better than not having. I speak from personal experience. When McDonald's hires people who are wayyyyyyyyy over qualified AND gives time off for doctors appointments and surgeries, let me know!
Waiting 6 months to begin chemo after you have been diagnosed with cancer is okay with you? Really? I would hazard a guess that 90% of the time it would be too late by then, but more power to ya. I am sure the lady two blocks away with 4 kids who never worked a day in her life and lives off the system will send flowers to your funeral.
 
Old 10-19-2010, 08:44 AM
 
28,163 posts, read 25,340,577 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LeavingMassachusetts View Post
Waiting 6 months to begin chemo after you have been diagnosed with cancer is okay with you? Really? I would hazard a guess that 90% of the time it would be too late by then, but more power to ya. I am sure the lady two blocks away with 4 kids who never worked a day in her life and lives off the system will send flowers to your funeral.
I didn't say it was ok but which is better: Waiting or not having at all?

And I would like to see where you are getting this 6 month wait time information from.
 
Old 10-19-2010, 09:27 AM
 
1,302 posts, read 1,808,275 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Magritte25 View Post
I didn't say it was ok but which is better: Waiting or not having at all?

And I would like to see where you are getting this 6 month wait time information from.
Check in with some Canadians. Why do you think the Mayo Clinic is so inundated with Canadian patients? They give up free care to pay for care across the border. Why? Because not only is it better, it is available. Free is never better.

We already have laws in this country not allowing a patient to be turned away for failure to pay. Turning it all over to a government run system to mirror other countries is dangerous and irresponsible. There is a lot more to it than "Yeah, everyone has insurance!" Everyone is going to suffer from it.
 
Old 10-19-2010, 09:37 AM
 
28,163 posts, read 25,340,577 times
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Most Canadians are very happy with their healthcare. I'm sure there are some who are not. *shrug* Does not negate the superiority of the HC system in Canada and other similar systems. That failure to pay issue is one of the main reasons healthcare insurance is so high!!!

The biggest complaint by Canadians is the amount of doctors/specialists vs. the amount of patients that exist. Sound familiar? It's one of the biggest problems of the US. It has NOTHING to do with who has HC and who does not. It has to do with malpractice insurance costs as well as the educational costs (timewise and financial) required to become a doctor/specialist.

You haven't a provided any proof to back up your assertions.
 
Old 10-19-2010, 10:10 AM
 
1,302 posts, read 1,808,275 times
Reputation: 1947
Quote:
Originally Posted by Magritte25 View Post
Most Canadians are very happy with their healthcare. I'm sure there are some who are not. *shrug* Does not negate the superiority of the HC system in Canada and other similar systems. That failure to pay issue is one of the main reasons healthcare insurance is so high!!!

The biggest complaint by Canadians is the amount of doctors/specialists vs. the amount of patients that exist. Sound familiar? It's one of the biggest problems of the US. It has NOTHING to do with who has HC and who does not. It has to do with malpractice insurance costs as well as the educational costs (timewise and financial) required to become a doctor/specialist.

You haven't a provided any proof to back up your assertions.
Irresponsible Doctors/Hospitals and patients are to blame for the high healthcare. Does your physician need to charge $130 for the 5 minutes he talked to you? Does he need to charge the full amount to someone not inusred when he is accepting payment from an insurance company of $20 as payment in full?

People spend hours of delibeartion time picking out a television but think nothing of expensive, unnecessary tests. The advent of HSA's and high deductible plans have started to combat some of the ridiculous spending. Now that it does not just cost a consumer a $15 co-pay, they are actually thinking about the money that is being spent because it is their own. I live in a state right now that has some of the best healthcare in the nation, it is also mandatory that everyone carries insurance. This, in my opinion, is a much better government intervention than running the whole system.

I can back it up with links of people complaining, of which you can do the same. It is the whole vaccination/co-sleeping/attachment parenting or any other debate. You can find anything on the internet. You are certainly entitled to your opinion as am I. But as a tax paying citizen, and seeing how well the government has handled Social Security. Education, Medicare etc..well, color me concerned.
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