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As the title says, I'm just at my wits end with out 4 year old son.
He's always been a difficult and extremely, ridiculously strong-willed child. The twos were horrible, however last year things seemed to have gotten a lot better and he was more agreeable and easier to get along with, we thought he was growing out of it. Well, last couple of months he's turned back into a monster. It's been back to the terrible twos with the whole 'NO!' thing, the tantrums and meltdowns, and absolutely nothing is working.
He's testing every boundary, pushing every limit, and is refusing to do routine things he's been doing with no problem - like washing his hands or getting dressed. Everything I tell him is a "No!" again. Nothing has really changed aside from him giving up his nap, which I suspect plays a role - because he very clearly needs one at least every few days because he's yawning and rubbing his eyes all afternoon, and then by 6 pm he's super edgy and cranky. Yet he will just NOT take a nap or even lie down. We put him to bed by 7:30 (hard to do it much earlier as DH gets home after 6), then he's up before 7 most days and will not go back and sleep a bit longer, and the cycle repeats.
The most difficult thing about all this, though, is that he just does not seem to respond to discipline. If he refuses to do something, it does not matter how we punish him or what reward we promise for compliance, because it seems absolutely nothing is as important to him as standing his ground. He thrives on power and control, and it's worth more to him than all the cartoons and toys and treats in the world. We have tried absolutely everything: timeouts, taking toys or privileges away, natural consequences, spanking, ignoring, praising, reasoning, explaining, rewarding good behaviour, sticker charts, schedules - and yet it still all feels like a crapshoot, because he'll only comply if he decides to do so.
He's extremely smart, I'd say gifted - taught himself to read before 3, writes, counts, does workbooks on his own at a grade 1 level. This means reasoning or logical explanations (he loves logic) combined with promise of a reward seem to be the only things that have more or less worked some of the time. Even if we make things up, as long as it 'sounds' like a scientific explanation, he seems to listen, the more complex the better. But still if he point-blank refuses to do something, which seems to be the current phase - there is absolutely nothing we can say or do to change his mind. We can, and do, follow up with consequences for not listening - and it doesn't faze him. He just takes it as a price to stand his ground.
We give choices and pick our battles where we can; however it seems like he can see through it, so he doesn't care about the choices UNLESS it's something he knows he can't have a choice in - so if he wants a cookie, giving a choice between carrot or apple won't work. Not only that, the cookie would need to be the exact specific type and shape he wants, otherwise he'll freak. He's got a very perfectionist, obsessive personality traits that actually concern me to an extent and we're thinking of looking into evaluating him for possible anxiety or OCD-type issues, as he gets fixated on things and has trouble shifting focus or calming himself during meltdowns. Regardless of that however, we still need to figure out how to gain control of his behaviour, because right now we feel powerless which is scary as he's only 4!
Here are a few examples of his stubborn-headedness:
- refused to change out of pyjamas and get dressed to go to the park and pool. We told him if he doesn't get dressed we can't go. Started wailing but still didn't get dressed. Gave him several chances to change his mind. In the end, we didn't go, he spent two hours in his room crying, yet still didn't get dressed
- last two years he had a thing with not wanting to wear short sleeves after wearing long ones all winter. We finally got him over it last summer and he's worn them fine; now this year, he remembered the same thing again. Last weekend got suddenly quite hot and I pulled out a T-shirt. Of course he refused to wear it. Told him it's too hot for long sleeves, and that he can choose a t-shirt he wants, but I'm putting all the long-sleeves away. Promised him an ice cream if he wears it, said we'll take a long-sleeved with us in case it gets cold, and we'll put it on after 5 pm, etc etc. He just kept repeating no. After running through the whole house naked, sobbing and looking for the long sleeved tops everywhere, he finally dug out a winter fleece top and put that on Finally I compromised to let him wear a t-shirt with an open zip-up on top, hoping I'll get it off of him later. Nope, he wouldn't take it off in spite of the heat, and even when the ice cream truck was there and we tried to get him to take it off in exchange for ice cream, he wouldn't do it. Cried that he wants ice cream but still wouldn't.
- Just now, refused to lie down for a bit of a 'quiet time' rest, even though he got up early and is clearly exhausted, rubbing his eyes, yawning every second, lying down on the floor. I begged him to just lie down for a little bit, said he didn't have to sleep, just rest for 30 minutes, and then he can watch TV; otherwise he won't be able to. He said he will at first, just after playing for a bit, but of course once play time was up - Nope, "no I don't want to", over and over and over again like a broken record. Oh and you should've seen him sighing and rolling his eyes worse than any teenager. After half an hour of pleading I finally gave up, said he's not getting TV today and that I'm going to rest myself and going to my room, not playing with him, not talking, and he gets no treats for the rest of the day. Took away the remote, went off and shut the door, I was so pissed. Which is where I am now, in tears because I just feel I have zero influence over his behaviour. What the hell are we going to do when he's 14, not 4?? I'm lost. Help!!!
Oh btw I've read all possible books and articles (yes, heard of Spirited Child, Love and Logic, 1-2-3 Magic) and even talked to a counselor, and nothing's helped. So please don't just throw out book titles. If you've read the book and think a certain technique is helpful, please be kind and just write it down here. Any practical advice would be very helpful, especially if you've experienced this kind of kid first-hand. Thank you.
My son will be 4 in a few months and he behaves very similar. He has autism though, so it is easier to discipline in some ways - but the attitude is certainly parallel and I'm sure very typical of 4. Refusing to transition to spring clothes, refusing to change clothes after PJs, saying no and go away. Sorry, I have no real advice as I have to deal with him differently, but I hear you on it!!!
Forgot to add that we talk things over endlessly, during the conflict and afterwards when he's in a good mood, we explain why this happened, and remind him over and over that his choice to do/ not to do X had led to consequence Y, and wouldn't it be better if he listened and we could be at the park right now eating ice cream and having fun and blah blah. And he understands everything perfectly, and retells the scenario exactly as it happened and rationalizes away. Yet when it comes to the next time, it's still the same, stubborness for the sake of stubborness...
So how come he can't choose a shirt with long sleeves? If he's that smart how come you're not allowing him to use his intelligence? Why are you battling against it? A "gifted" four year old who taught himself to read can pick out his own shirt. (Trust me on that.) Unless Mom is controlling and won't let him. You've claimed he can reason and use logic..... let him.
"Quite hot." Really? Where do you live that it's 95 outside and the kid is going to get heat stroke if he wears a long sleeve shirt in March? The Australian outback?
You want practical advice? Let him fall asleep on the floor and step over him. Or pick him up and put him on the couch. He'd probably flop on the couch and rest on his own if you weren't making such a big deal out of him doing it your way. You're making it harder than it needs to be.
Last edited by DewDropInn; 03-18-2014 at 07:51 PM..
The thing is we've gone through this last year already so I knew it wasn't just that particular shirt on that day, it was the transition from long to short sleeve which would need to be done eventually. We live in Cali so it does get hot enough in the summer that he can't just stay in long sleeves and pants all summer long. Wasn't 95 but was 80 this weekend. Last year we tried letting it go as long as we could, he'd get hot and sweaty, but basically it took several times of just putting all the long sleeves away and breaking that habit, and then he was perfectly fine in tees and shorts all summer and never remembered that hang-up. He's had similar things with not wanting to wear something new - new pjs, new underwear, not because he didn't like it but just because it's new. We've had to persevere through it anyway. I'm all for letting him choose what to wear appropriately, but we can't have him never wear anything new or transition seasonal clothing.
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You want practical advice? Let him fall asleep on the floor and step over him. Or pick him up and put him on the couch.
I wish except he's never fallen asleep anywhere but his own bed (very rarely in the car) since he was about a year old. He doesn't fall asleep on the floor, he just gets cranky and weepy and even more wound up at nighttime and drive everyone crazy including himself.
Get him tested. He sounds like he is acute autistic or ADHD. Ask your doctor or net search a facility to go to.
As I said we're looking into getting him evaluated for some potential ocd-type issues. However he's most definitely nowhere near autistic - he's very social, extremely verbal, playful, has a great sense of humor, plays well with other kids and chats to adults, etc. ADHD doesn't fit either, rather it's like he's the opposite of that - he's always had an extremely long attention span, even as an infant, and could spend a long time doing an activity, which is why it's always been next to impossible to distract or redirect him from something - he'd remember what he wanted and look for it for the longest time, even as a young baby.
He doesn't quite seem to fit any of the diagnoses I've read about in fact, and even the therapist i talked to was kind of stumped though she did say some of his behaviour didn't sound quite typical. But it doesn't fit any of the typical ASD/ADHD/sensory integration/ODD labels that they often give kids these days. OCD tendencies and/or anxiety is the only one that comes close to describing him, though all kids have ocd tendencies to an extent. Also everything I've read about gifted kids sounds a lot like him and highlights these types of behaviour issues being common. But we still need to know how to handle it.
Are you from CA originally? Doesn't sound like it. Look around you. "Seasonal clothing" is a hoodie over shorts and flip flops when it's chilly and rainy. Californians don't DO "seasonal clothing". If you're making him wear something different then the rest of the kids in the park..... that's your problem. I'd bet there are several kids in the park and at the store in their PJ's. At 3 in the afternoon.
(I know CA businessmen who wear shorts on airplanes. To Boston. In February. Lol, you are going to have to loosen up or you'll be fighting him until the day he leaves for college. Sorry. CA is its own world.)
Last edited by DewDropInn; 03-18-2014 at 08:12 PM..
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Finally I compromised to let him wear a t-shirt with an open zip-up on top, hoping I'll get it off of him later. Nope, he wouldn't take it off in spite of the heat, and even when the ice cream truck was there and we tried to get him to take it off in exchange for ice cream, he wouldn't do it. Cried that he wants ice cream but still wouldn't. 
As I said we're looking into getting him evaluated for some potential ocd-type issues. However he's most definitely nowhere near autistic - he's very social, extremely verbal, playful, has a great sense of humor, plays well with other kids and chats to adults, etc. ADHD doesn't fit either, rather it's like he's the opposite of that - he's always had an extremely long attention span, even as an infant, and could spend a long time doing an activity, which is why it's always been next to impossible to distract or redirect him from something - he'd remember what he wanted and look for it for the longest time, even as a young baby.
