Meskwaki Feminist: An Oxymoron?

[soUlwounD]

Originally Posted by Rewester

It's not a reservation, it's a settlement.

Now, I know you aren't talking about me, because I would not have told you those things. But I am also an atheist and Meskwaki and a female and a self proclaimed feminist.

At some point, you cannot separate culture and religion. So it is confusing to decide which practices to keep because you want to preserve the culture, and which to discard of. People still try to convert us, so you can imagine how sensitive one can become when if they perceive they are being attacked.

Do I follow the "rules" of my period in my home? No, I don't believe in it. Do I follow them at ceremonies? Yes. Because you don't go to someone's funeral or baptism or wedding and scream "you're all superstitious heathens" when people are praying. That would be rude.

Could you tell more? I am in a situation where a religious person claims to be a feminist but is culturally and religiously so blind that cannot see religion cannot lead feminism.

I supposed to become along with her in feminism issues and I am practically cutting my shirt and pants... I try to understand her but I can't. She is claiming her "feministic" ideology straightforward from her religion and culture and she strongly believes it is feminism...

I supposed to work with her at least a year and I just want her out... If those would be only her personal use, I would not care but she shares that word "of feminism" and... It is not working very well.. I try to respect her but I cannot.

[soUlwounD]

Originally Posted by Johnny Ace

Thank you, Charles. She also has the urge to smudge a room if, say, something tragic happened there. Smudging consists of burning a "sacred" dried foliage (cedar needles, for instance) and tossing the smoke around the room to "purify" it. I asked her why, as an atheist, she does this, and she couldn't give me a straight answer. She gave vague spiritual reasons but when I asked for a precise explanation she got frustrated and defensive and said it's hard to explain.

Sometimes life learn things become just habits without need to believe in it.

[mordant]

Originally Posted by Matt Marcinkiewicz

I think of it more this way: I've lived my entire entire life in greater Buffalo, NY. In certain impartial discussions I'd be inclined to admit that Buffalo is not a great place to be. But if you started making fun of Buffalo in my presence, I'd get far more defensive than if it was "consensual criticism" in an otherwise neutral (or neutral-seeming, or positive-seeming) setting.

I know this because it's happened to me (it = backlash-provoking situations; attacks on my home turf that I'd probably otherwise agree with if they were stated more tactfully) on more than one occasion, and I have a feeling something similar was at work with Johnny Ace's direct criticism of Miss Meskwaki's traditional practices, to which she likely has some core psychological attachment

I've never had those kinds of attachments to place, ethnicity, or tradition. The only time i'm defensive is if someone seems to be questioning my integrity or ascribing intentions or feelings or thoughts to me that I don't actually have. Perhaps that is at the core of loyalty to place and culture, because they are part of our identity. I probably lack that because my primal identity has largely been destroyed by circumstance. My family of origin is all but dead, I left my religion of origin long ago, I've lived in many different regions, and I never had so much as a favorite sports team to root for. I am just a nerdy old guy in a house. I can't even sustain a territorial debate over WIntel vs Apple, as I own Apple hardware and remote into Microsoft servers.

I have to say though that I don't mind; it's kind of tiresome defending turf. At the end of the day it doesn't really mean anything.

[ConeyGirl52]

Originally Posted by Johnny Ace

My friend is part Meskwaki and grew up on an Indian reservation. She identifies herself as a progressive, liberal atheist and therefore a feminist. The reservation has a history of serious social and cultural problems such as drug addiction and family dysfunction, of which my friend is a product. She has on many occasions stressed the volatile nature of the reservation and how people are better off leaving it for the city.

The Meskwaki culture is highly conservative and as far as I know the tribal council is entirely made up of men. My friend tells me that politically it's very backwards and corrupt. In traditional Meskwaki culture, when a woman is menstruating, she is not allowed to eat from the same pot as her family and has to eat alone, away from everyone. The literal English translation for the Meskwaki word for menstruation is "bad way." My friend has a batch of Indian corn that was to be used for a ceremony, but since she was having her period while preparing it, it couldn't be used. I criticized these suppressive, superstitious practices towards menstruation as very old-world and extremely sexist, yet despite her supposedly similar progressive views, this made my friend defensive and irritated. How could anyone with a trace of feminism defend such a blatantly discriminatory and sexist culture? How is the logical behind these barbaric, superstitious practices much better than that of 16th century witch hunting?

I think you are looking at the ways of a culture you don't understand, and applying the logic of a culture you do understand to it. It doesn't work.

First of all, you are confusing reverence for sexism. Women have the ability to create, carry and bring forth life. That in and of itself is a powerful and sacred thing.

Generally speaking, only tribal shamans are not afraid to mess with spiritually powerful and sacred things. Many tribes no longer live like they used to for many generations. Each family has their own house, subsequently women no longer menstruate at the same time as they would if they were living closely together. Their spirituality and power seems lost amongst the tribe, as the people become more and more immersed in mainstream goods and culture.

Tribes are rarely sexist. If you think logically about it, in most tribes women hold more possessions and power than the men. Sure, the chiefs are the flashy one's that take public attention within and outside of the tribe, but traditionally, the women let it be known to the chiefs what needs to be done to benefit the tribe. Most tribes have their "Grandmothers" or "Beloved Women" who send word to the council expressing their opinions.

I cant speak for all tribes, but in the one I know well, the chiefs could ignore these women 3 times, before they were no longer chiefs. There is a balance there. It is hardly sexist.

Have you ever seen a covey of birds in the wild - let's say turkeys. When danger is present, the hens crouch low, while the toms remain upright and stretch their necks and heads high. Why do you think that is?

Your friend is naturally going to become defensive and irritated. A friend would nicely ask - without passing their own judgement - about why things are the way they are. When you pass judgement without having any understanding, you automatically separate yourself from that person, and maybe, without intending to, deeply hurt and offend that person. You are, after all, passing judgment on her as well.

The tribe is her family. Her relations.

[ConeyGirl52]

Originally Posted by Johnny Ace

Thank you, Charles. She also has the urge to smudge a room if, say, something tragic happened there. Smudging consists of burning a "sacred" dried foliage (cedar needles, for instance) and tossing the smoke around the room to "purify" it. I asked her why, as an atheist, she does this, and she couldn't give me a straight answer. She gave vague spiritual reasons but when I asked for a precise explanation she got frustrated and defensive and said it's hard to explain.

Cedar is an antiseptic, astringent, insecticidal, and fungicidal substance. The smoke and oil really can cleanse an area.

As I eluded to before, the people are losing much of their old ways as they become just as immersed in mainstream culture as you are. She may simply know it works, but cant tell you why - hence, her frustration.

Even mainstream America, in the 1700s and 1800s, would burn cedar to cleanse a sick room. They didn't have the handy can of chemical-based Lysol from the grocery store, so they used what they had.