air quality in pittsburgh - anything new being done to help? (New Castle: rent, neighborhoods)

[roamingveg]

Hello,

We've been thinking about relocating to Pittsburgh for a while now. One thing that really concerns me is the air quality rating. I know it's gotten better since the 80's, but it is still ranked pretty badly for small particle pollution which is linked directly to lung and heart disease.

Here's a quote from a Team 4 news story from 2005:

"According to the Pennsylvania Department of Health, the top communities for heart and lung disease deaths combined over a three-year period were Elizabeth, Verona, Oakmont, Brackenridge, Bridgeville, Cheswick, East Pittsburgh, McKeesport and McKees Rocks. Each of those nine communities is close to a major industrial source of PM2.5."

I am not familiar enough with the area to know how far out these places spread... how far away do you have to move from Pittsburgh to avoid these places, and how long would the commute be into the city?

Also, does anyone know of any recent initiatives to improve the air quality? If we move, it still won't be for a year or two anyway... so maybe whatever is being done now will create a significant improvement by the time we're ready to move.

I just posted a similar question in the PA forum.. sorry for the repeat, I'm new to this and didn't realize there was a Pittsburgh forum. Thanks in advance for any insights!

[Renaldo5000]

The main study that is always quoted was bogus. They took the samples from right next to the only steel mill left in the area. Of course it wasn't going to be good. Maybe fifty years ago it could be said that Pittsburgh's air quality was horrible because there was a mill every 300 feet, but not anymore. The Pittsburgh metro area just doesn't have a lot of people or manufacturing in comparison to other metros, so how could our overall air quality be worse? We have a lot of lung disease here because everybody smokes.

I would suggest the suburbs for you. To the north there is Ross, Wexford, and Cranberry. To the south is Mt. Lebanon, Upper St. Clair (if you've got $$$), and Dormont. To the west are McMansion-y new places like Pine and Moon. To the east there is Murrysville.

Give us an idea of what kind of lifestyle you want, what your price range is and how far you are willing to drive/sit in traffic. Are schools important? There are a myriad of living options in the Pittsburgh area that can probably satisfy your basic desires.

[BrianTH]

The relatively serious air-pollution problems are largely concentrated in limited areas. The most serious problem is in the Liberty-Clairton area, and U.S. Steel is supposed to be addressing that with a massive renovation of its Clairton coke works, but that has been an off-and-on process. Here is some reading on the subject if you are interested:

Liberty-Clairton pollution area approved

Anyway, you can easily avoid that area if you want (there is no particular reason for most people in the Pittsburgh region to go there, or even pass through).

Most places in the region, all I would suggest is that you be careful about being down in a valley with a major highway.

[grimacista]

In addition to the expected improvements at the Clairton Coke Works, ATI is apparently re-doing its operations in Brackenridge/Natrona in order to cut down on the air pollution up there.

The air pollution data in the county is drastically different because most places are like anywhere USA but the places that always get focused on are right next to or downwind of sizable industrial operations, like the Mon Valley, Neville Island, and Natrona area.

[roamingveg]

Wow, thanks so much for the answers so far! Sounds like there's hope!

We're a small single-income family, so affordability is key. I have no idea what kind of income we'd have if we moved there... But we'd have to at least be making better than average income for the area to make the move worth it. (We're in Texas right now.) Is the average income really only about $37,000? That's what the main city data page says. But salary.com says that the living expenses are slightly higher and the average salary for my husband's job title are slightly higher in Pittsburgh than where we are in Texas.. so I'm not sure I believe the $37k number. But I'm guessing the $$$ area you mentioned will probably not work for us if it is true. Good schools will be an important factor in a few years when our daughter is old enough for kindergarten. We would probably rent for the first year no matter what, just to become more familiar with the overall area. A 30-40 minute commute is tolerable to start with if it's at least moving traffic... it would be nice to avoid 30-40 minutes in crawling traffic. 15 minutes max commute would be ideal. But I'm mostly concerned with living somewhere healthy, especially if we end up settling there for decades to come. It would also be great to not be too far from vegetarian restaurants, health food stores or food co-ops.

I actually spent one summer in the Pitt area a very long time ago.. I liked some of the neighborhoods in the city itself, although now I wouldn't be interested in any parts heavily populated by students. But I liked being able to take a bus to get around. I don't know how affordable living inside Pittsburgh proper is, but if the air quality is good there and it's not ridiculously expensive, it would be nice not to be too far from work and stuff to do.

So it seems like Pittsburgh in general isn't so bad with the air quality? I wish they were more specific on the american lung association website, which I just checked out because it seems more legit than a local news story. It just lists "Pittsburgh-New Castle" as #5 in year-round particle pollution and #3 in short-term particle pollution. But I'm glad to hear that you guys think it is easy to avoid.. and I'm glad to hear there are plans for improvement. I guess it's already obvious that things are improving anyway, because I think Pittsburgh was higher on the list of worst cities a few years ago.. it used to be #2 right behind LA. So dropping a level or two is promising.

[PeterRabbit]

I wonder how we'd compare if the Lung Assoc. didn't use the coke mill in Clairton as one of it's spots to measure? It seems to me it is far away from the majority of the population here depending on how the wind blows. I understand we get bad stuff from OH & WV because of the wind.

[Aqua Teen Carl]

I've seen a couple of topics similar to this and it always seems that New Castle pops up. New Castle is a ways outside Pittsburgh and won't affect the air quality of the city itself. The air quality here has never been an issue as far back as I can remember, I wouldn't worry about it.

The only places where you are going to have industrial parks near residential housing is in Beaver county.

[Craziaskowboi]

One thing to think about: due to orographic lifting and the fact that Pittsburgh is on the windward side of the Appalachian Mountains, much of the air pollution isn't even Pittsburgh's fault. Chicago, St. Louis, Indianapolis, Louisville, Detroit, Cincinnati, Columbus and Cleveland all send their pollution east, and there's nothing that Pittsburgh can do about it. This is also why western Pennsylvania has the most acidic rainfall in the U.S. (even though it's not as bad as it was 25 years ago). Basically, if Pittsburgh's air quality is crappy, half of it is crap from other cities to the west.

[sr1234]

Air quality is bad in SWPA, Eastern Ohio, and the Northern WV panhandle. We just deal with it. There are chemical and coal manufacturing companies all over the area. The only way that it will stop is when the companies close their doors.

Here are a couple articles/facts of the many:
Acid Cloud Fine Levied Against Indspec Chemical Plant - Health News Story - WTAE Pittsburgh (http://www.thepittsburghchannel.com/health/19518845/detail.html - broken link)
List of Schools | Assessing Outdoor Air Near Schools | US EPA
Neville Chemical to pay pollution law fine to feds
U. S. Steel - Facilities

The other big problem in the area is mine subsidence issues.

[Renaldo5000]

Originally Posted by roamingveg

Is the average income really only about $37,000?

It all matters what your husband does and what his qualifications are. There are lot of people in Pittsburgh who live off of less than $15,000 a year and there are people who have professional jobs who are pulling in $50,000-$80,000 a year. Overall salaries do tend to be lower here. However, this is offset by lower housing costs.

Originally Posted by roamingveg

Good schools will be an important factor in a few years when our daughter is old enough for kindergarten.

You probably want to live in the suburbs then (unless you have the money for private schools). There are a few good city schools here and there, but most are rather lackluster from what I hear. And the vaunted "magnet schools" in the city can be hard to get into. Also, the city income tax is 3% whereas all of the outlying municipalities tend to hover at about 1%.

Originally Posted by roamingveg

A 30-40 minute commute is tolerable to start with if it's at least moving traffic... it would be nice to avoid 30-40 minutes in crawling traffic. 15 minutes max commute would be ideal.

Before you start thinking about how far your commute will be and where you should live geographically, how about getting the husband a job first? Who knows what he does and who knows where he could end up? He could end up in a skyscraper downtown or an office park 30 minutes outside of the city.

Originally Posted by roamingveg

It would also be great to not be too far from vegetarian restaurants, health food stores or food co-ops.

This opens up a whole new can of worms. "Vegetarian restaurants" and "food co-ops" are not normal in the Pittsburgh area. They only exist in or near the "hip" or "nicer" city neighborhoods (mainly on the East End). The hip neighborhoods (South Side, Lawrenceville, Oakland, Bloomfield) are mainly full of old yinzers and young kids in college who support such businesses. With you having a child I would only advise Bloomfield out of those listed spots. Young professionals, college students with money and a few families here and there can be found in Shadyside and Squirrel Hill, but these neighborhoods are more expensive. Point Breeze is a very well-to-do neighborhood of the city that doesn't have much of a business district, but it is near everything. Regent Square is "Squirrel Hill on a budget" and is full of middle and upper-middle class people and is also reasonably close to things. Most of the places where "healthy" and cool stuff is are for young single people who want to be where the action is....not a family. Out in the burbs there is not much "healthy granola" stuff like you want - you will see Best Buys, Walmarts, Targets and Applebees as far as the eye can see. Pittsburgh just is not very progressive when it comes to health.

Originally Posted by roamingveg

I don't know how affordable living inside Pittsburgh proper is, but if the air quality is good there and it's not ridiculously expensive, it would be nice not to be too far from work and stuff to do.

Well, as I mentioned before you might want to find out where your husband will work before you settle for a place. But, based on some of the things you are mentioning I think that maybe a nice first-ring suburb with a walkable downtown might be your cup of tea. Check out Dormont. Also check out Oakmont and Aspinwall. Mt. Lebanon if you have some more cash.

Originally Posted by roamingveg

So it seems like Pittsburgh in general isn't so bad with the air quality?

It is a metropolitan area with over two million people. The air is not going to be pristine because of this mere fact. But, is it as bad as these dumb little studies insinuate? No. I walk and ride bike every day and my lungs work just fine.