Will the proposed light rail to New Ken really happen? (Pittsburgh: apartment, city hall)

[Copanut]

Originally Posted by BrianTH

From 1996 to 2006, Golden Triangle employment increased from 88,549 to 109,619, which is 23.8%.

What are the stats from 1976 to 1996?

[BrianTH]

Originally Posted by ctoocheck

And if you think about it, I'd bet there used to be even more jobs in the "suburbs" back in the steel era (what with all the factories in towns like Braddock, New Ken, whereever) than there are today.

Absolutely. There are also rural areas within the metro which have lost population and jobs.

To be sure, this is a mixed issue for commuter rail--the depopulation of the Mon Valley is part of why the McKeesport line failed, although that was a complex situation--see here:

History: Pittsburgh's PATrain

But the wheel is still turning, and things are now changing once again in ways that make commuter rail, as part of a smart overall Allegheny riverfront plan, viable.

[BrianTH]

Originally Posted by Copanut

All I know is the YMCA moved because of the lack of people coming downtown.

Again, that is anecdotal. Plus, the Y has opened up two new locations Downtown (USX and Market Square).

[airwave09]

Originally Posted by Copanut

I won't argue that point.

But get real, how many people work downtown?

Things change, look at South Pointe, look at Cranberry with Westinghouse moving there.

I grew up with the expression, Just like downtown!

Guess what, who cares about downtown these days?

How many in the past references are you going to make, for god sakes? We get it, you are an old geezer that hates change and remembers the "good 'ole days" fondly. Let's move on please... If Pittsburgh wants to stay relevant in the 21st century, then we need more progressive thinkers and supporters like BrianTH, alleghenyangel, ect. to have their voices heard around in this city.

So when are making your final pilgrimage to Florida Copanut? Sorry no offense, I just had to... lol

[youngabe]

Originally Posted by Copanut

Sorry, all of my best friends work in the suburbs. IMHO, the downtown area is not the hub it used to be.

It must all be in individual perspective--more than 5 of my friends who used to work in the suburbs, now work Downtown and 2 even stayed with the same company. I personally work Downtown and see no downturn in the crowds of people who work here. With the rebirth of city living and even Downtown living for that matter--Downtown offices are going no where fast.

[BrianTH]

Originally Posted by Copanut

What are the stats from 1976 to 1996?

No clue. If you really want to know, I'd ask Chris Briem at Pitt.

[Copanut]

Trust me, I support this area more than you ever have.

Yeah, I'm an old fart, 58, that worked downtown for about 3 months in the 80's that spent about half my salary on parking and lunches.

Things change, downtown is not what it used to be. Why pay all that money for parking, when you can get it for free in the burbs?

Why pay all that rent in Downtown, again, when it's cheaper in the burbs?


Things have to change.

[BrianTH]

The idea that Downtown is dying is one of the enduring myths in Pittsburgh. It is certainly true that the Downtown residential population almost entirely disappeared and has just recently been recovering. A lot of the regional retail scene also shifted out to the suburbs with the rise of suburban shopping malls and depopulation of the City. But as an employment center, Downtown has motored right along.

[youngabe]

Originally Posted by Copanut

Trust me, I support this area more than you ever have.

Yeah, I'm an old fart, 58, that worked downtown for about 3 months in the 80's that spent about half my salary on parking and lunches.

Things change, downtown is not what it used to be. Why pay all that money for parking, when you can get it for free in the burbs?

Why pay all that rent in Downtown, again, when it's cheaper in the burbs?


Things have to change.

You're basing all of your information on nothing more than assumptions or things from your perspective. I personally work for a company who has a development subsidiary. We own property Downtown that has retail and apartments. If there is ever a vacancy, we have a waiting list. While your perspective works for you, it doesn't work for everyone. If it did, the suburbs would be one overrun place.

Also, parking is not everything. My employer covers my parking fully...while I understand that's rare, I know several Downtown employers who give their employees "allowances" for either parking or transit fares so that it isn't all an out of pocket expense.

Lunch? Try Zorbas on Smithfield where you can easily eat for $5. Before I started working Downtown my lunches were WAY more expensive in the "burbs" with all the chain joints. If people expand their horizons, don't go by "I heard..." and explore for themselves, it's very easily doable.

You're right things change--and they definitely have since the 80s.

[ctoocheck]

Wouldn't it be great if we could connect employment and neighborhood centers, providing transportation options and a stimulus for growth? For example, connecting downtown and New Ken with a rail link ;-)

Wouldn't it be great if you could live in a town and walk and lunch and to shop to work instead of driving to work, parking in a sea of parking (which appears to be free but whose maintenance costs are hidden to the user and subsidized by tenants)? Not all jobs have to be downtown (like you said, rent and parking are expensive) but it would be better if they were grouped in centers (in New Ken, Oakland, Lawrenceville, McKeesport, wherever) than sprawled and disconnected across the region. Things do have to change, and I'd prefer change go in that direction. I mean, I guess it's hard to accomplish easily without a government that stipulates/encourages such development, but... it'd be nice.