Is Pittsburgh America's Most Livable City? - Parts 1 & 2 (how much, ranking)
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Many of you need to understand that Pittsburgh is considered to be racist not because of the segregation of its people but because of other factors.
Black healthcare in the region is the worst in the state and ranks pretty high nationally, considering Pittsburgh has one of the best healthcare systems in the Country. Do any of you remember the the Diversity study done by University of Pittsburgh?
Justice from police brutality cases is almost unheard of there, from the recent attack by the police in Homewood to the J. Gammage case some years back. Can anyone remember the last time that a white police officer was convicted of police brutality against a person of color?
Education, to be more specific city schools (except proably Taylor Alderdice) are not funded like the suburban schools considering that city residents pay higher taxes on average. Many people complain that urban schools that are predominately black are closed at a higher rate than white schools.
Employment, granted that nationally unemployment for the AA's have been hit the hardest during the recession, but Pittsburgh's black population has ALWAYS been that way regardless of how well the rest of the country does. Certain employers and even some factions in the government have been "screening" potential applicants based on assumed ethnicies and or the zip codes of the applicants. A couple of friends of mine, one Italian and one black sent resumes to the same company with exactly the same qualifications. We used the same zip codes (the addresses was across the street from each other) 5 out of 5 times my italian friend was granted an interview "Jamal" was not even called. That was actually the second experienment, the first came about through a first hand experience. I sent 6 resumes to different companies using the 15219 (downtown/hill) zipcode and six with my State College zipcode to those same companies. I was called for 4 interviews with the State College resumes and never called with the other one. I actually went to one of the interviews and once I got there, I was than told the the position had been filled. Since I have an old world first and sur name there was no telling of my ethnic background.
Is this still going on? I don't know but I would not be surprised. I did notice that many AAs that have pretty good jobs are not native of Pittsburgh, and the few native AA that do have jobs have at some point left the city and came back. I don't know how or what to make of it and I guess many of you will come to your own conclusions. Pittsburgh does not have the Klan marching around in sheets because a suit and tie is more effective.
I don't think that many whites or some well off blacks will agree about what I have written, but it is what it is. Just because you don't experience it or see it does not mean that it is not there. I'm pretty sure that it is not just the poor and uneducated screaming racism, but the few blacks in Corporate Pittsburgh THINK the same thing but want to keep their piece of the American dream by remaining silent.
Once again, police injustices, lack of healthcare, poor schools, and high unemployment are drastically affecting every single race in America. To say "such and such sucks because I'm white/black/yellow/pink/purple" is further increasing racial divide. Stop blame shifting, we're all in this mess of a society together.
Many of you need to understand that Pittsburgh is considered to be racist not because of the segregation of its people but because of other factors.
A rather patronising way of putting your view, isn't it? Perhaps you define "racism" as any aspect of society which is disadvantageous or not specifically to the benefit of black people. Others might define the term more narrowly, as an explicitly formulated ideology concerning the existence of identifiable human "races", their relative superiority or inferiority, and consequent beliefs about the proper arrangement of privilege within the social order.
Quote:
Black healthcare in the region is the worst in the state
Given the present arrangements for access to care, I'd be very surprised otherwise. Naturally, a population with below-average educational achievement is likely to hold disproportionately lower-paid work, which in this country means little or no access to insurance and therefore health care. By the first definition of racism, this is racist because it is to the disadvantage of black people. By the second it is not, because it is a consequence of the structure of American society rather than of an explicitly formulated theory of racial superiority.
Quote:
Justice from police brutality
As I've said above, this seems to me a valid point. Whether such instances derive from explicit ideas about racial superiority remains to be demonstrated, partly because police officers accused of brutality are not tried. Determining whether or not explicitly racist ideologies exist, or are common, among the police seems to me an excellent reason for such trials.
Quote:
Education, to be more specific city schools
This again would qualify as racist under the "anything which hurts or doesn't help black people" definition. By the alternate definition, the disgraceful state of public education in Pittsburgh and certain suburbs is clearly not a consequence of ideologically formulated racism, all the more so since the most disgraceful public education authorities in the area are headed and largely staffed by black people.
Quote:
Employment..."screening" potential applicants based on assumed ethnicies
Given the abysmal quality of education to which poor people of any race have access here, it's hardly surprising that employment opportunities for the poor are limited, or that they suffer most when times are hard. Clearly however, this a function of the structure of American society rather than an explicit ideology of racism.
The undeniable reluctance of many employers to hire people with Arabic-derived or so-called "crazy names" might be an expression of overt ideological racism, or it might be a more or less unconscious recognition by the employer that American society has dysfunctional systems of education and health which, for their greatest victims, produce unwell and ill-prepared potential employees. Obviously, unfair or not, parents should consider whether its in the interests of their children to give them Arabic-sounding or "crazy" names.
Quote:
Pittsburgh does not have the Klan marching around in sheets because a suit and tie is more effective.
Please forgive my saying so, but this is very muddled thinking. Overt explicit ideological racism should certainly be exposed, challenged and defeated - on that most of us will agree. If the Klan marches, march back.
For the rest, we have two choices. We might conclude as you do that dysfunctional aspects of American society which unfairly disadvantage the poor, including poor black people, are signs of covert "suit and tie" racism. But you can't challenge and defeat something you can't find or identify, so beyond that conclusion there's nothing to be done.
Or we might conclude that these dysfunctional aspects of our society need to be changed, so that all the people they disadvantage will be relieved of the burden imposed on them.
In other words, identifying unfair aspects of American society as "racist" when they are actually injustices is a dead-end, and rather than blaming nebulous "suit and tie" racism for these injustices, it would be better to work for change.
Peacefully if possible, by any means if necessary.
Pittsburgh does not have the Klan marching around in sheets because a suit and tie is more effective.
Wow that is a strong statement. I can understand a bit of both sides and they do exist. Sometimes they exist to as extreme as you put it.
Sort of reminds me of my real estate days. I had a very wealthy Indian (with the dot, not feathers) client. They were some of the nicest people I have ever met. The price range they were in was well over a million and they had that and then some. Self made, I might ad. It was amazing what I dealt with from some sellers of properties. Some wouldn't even sell to an Indian, I kid you not. One sold for $400K less then the Indian offer a year later because they refused to sell to them. It was an eye opener how deep some things could run. It really made me sad. They were used to it and it didn't bother them at all. Anyway, I am sure many blacks have dealt with all this stuff on occasion. It sure is some odd stuff.
Seems to me the only way out of all this stuff is to work hard and educate yourself. Keep your home nice and do well. I think respect will come, but it will never come from everyone. Lets face it there are plenty of dim bulbs roaming around.
A rather patronising way of putting your view, isn't it? Perhaps you define "racism" as any aspect of society which is disadvantageous or not specifically to the benefit of black people. Others might define the term more narrowly, as an explicitly formulated ideology concerning the existence of identifiable human "races", their relative superiority or inferiority, and consequent beliefs about the proper arrangement of privilege within the social order.
Nice try, If I was any other race and I experienced the same thing I would have written about that as well. The "benefit of black people" remark is rather condescending, should I have written "the well off whites don't give a damn about anyone else but themselves"? Racism is the belief that one group is better than the other. Well, denying a group of people based on the color of their skin inadequate healthcare, education, employment and fair justice in the legal system a form of racism?
Given the present arrangements for access to care, I'd be very surprised otherwise. Naturally, a population with below-average educational achievement is likely to hold disproportionately lower-paid work, which in this country means little or no access to insurance and therefore health care. By the first definition of racism, this is racist because it is to the disadvantage of black people. By the second it is not, because it is a consequence of the structure of American society rather than of an explicitly formulated theory of racial superiority.
You still don't get it? If your educational system is flawed so will your chances to obtain additional education on the next level thus keeping you in financial bondage. Oh, by the way just because it is happening in other parts of the country does not mean that it has to happen in Pittsburgh. I read earlier in the post comparisions to NOVA where many blacks are doing quite well.
As I've said above, this seems to me a valid point. Whether such instances derive from explicit ideas about racial superiority remains to be demonstrated, partly because police officers accused of brutality are not tried. Determining whether or not explicitly racist ideologies exist, or are common, among the police seems to me an excellent reason for such trials.
If what you are saying is true, there would be more cases of police brutality against whites would'nt there? There was a case where a police officer brutally beat up an unarmed white guy, he was suspended and I think fired and the victim sued and won. Meanwhile back at the ranch, a young innocent high school kid gets beat down and his hair gets pulled out but yet nothing was done to the officers involved. Which reminds me, how offend do police officers hide in the bushes of predominately white neighborhoods and attack their residents like the young man from Homewood?
This again would qualify as racist under the "anything which hurts or doesn't help black people" definition. By the alternate definition, the disgraceful state of public education in Pittsburgh and certain suburbs is clearly not a consequence of ideologically formulated racism, all the more so since the most disgraceful public education authorities in the area are headed and largely staffed by black people.
What difference does that make when the people that hold the purse strings are not black? That is just like giving a patrolman a wiffleball bat to maintain order at a bar fight. A token position with no real power or money in a community plagued with so many issues means very little. So how many black mayors of Pittsburgh do you know?
Given the abysmal quality of education to which poor people of any race have access here, it's hardly surprising that employment opportunities for the poor are limited, or that they suffer most when times are hard. Clearly however, this a function of the structure of American society rather than an explicit ideology of racism.
Have you ever read a history book? One of the first things that Europeans enforced when the first Africans were brought over here was they were NOT to be educated. They clearly realized that education was the key to progession and discontent. Once people realize that there are better worlds out there and everywhere is not like the place that they are presently in, they will protest. Ever heard of the Watt Riots? Also please explain that whenever "times are hard" blacks tend to suffer the worst? We all can't be uneducated
The undeniable reluctance of many employers to hire people with Arabic-derived or so-called "crazy names" might be an expression of overt ideological racism, or it might be a more or less unconscious recognition by the employer that American society has dysfunctional systems of education and health which, for their greatest victims, produce unwell and ill-prepared potential employees. Obviously, unfair or not, parents should consider whether its in the interests of their children to give them Arabic-sounding or "crazy" names.
Sooo, what you are saying is that blacks and other minorities cannot name are children whatever they choose to do so because the powers to be don't like them? I should be treated just like anyone else rather my name is Dejuan, Bijui or Becky-Sue. If weeding potential job applicants out because of their names does not reek of racism I don't know what else will. If a name that you are not familiar to you sounds "crazy" why would that give you the right to deny them the chance of getting a better life?
Please forgive my saying so, but this is very muddled thinking. Overt explicit ideological racism should certainly be exposed, challenged and defeated - on that most of us will agree. If the Klan marches, march back.
My thinking would be "muddled" to someone who has never walked in a black person's shoes. Many whites will never see the things that go on regarding race in Pittsburgh simply because it will never happen to them. I will never feel the adrenaline rush of a skydiver, nor will I ever feel the panic when my chute does not open either. Why? Because I'm not a skydiver and never will be. Because of this I cannot dismiss the adrenaline rush felt by those who do.
For the rest, we have two choices. We might conclude as you do that dysfunctional aspects of American society which unfairly disadvantage the poor, including poor black people, are signs of covert "suit and tie" racism. But you can't challenge and defeat something you can't find or identify, so beyond that conclusion there's nothing to be done.
First you have to leave that river which is denile and realize that there is a probelm. Secondly, identify who is the enemy. Finally take action, against all involved and go from there. Oh, and like I said before the people they are affected are just not the poor blacks.
Or we might conclude that these dysfunctional aspects of our society need to be changed, so that all the people they disadvantage will be relieved of the burden imposed on them.
In other words, identifying unfair aspects of American society as "racist" when they are actually injustices is a dead-end, and rather than blaming nebulous "suit and tie" racism for these injustices, it would be better to work for change.
Well tell me what you call it? If a group of people deny me the same freedoms that they enjoy because of my skin color what would you REALLY want to call it? Being fair? Do want me to stop complaining and suffer? Turn a blind eye because people feel uncomfortable with the truth?
Peacefully if possible, by any means if necessary.
Funny that you should quote a man who gave his life to stop injustice but yet you turn a blind eye away from it.
Cities are scored on political and social stability, crime rates and access to quality health care. The survey also measures the diversity and standard of cultural events and the natural environment; education; and the standard of infrastructure, including public transport.
Honolulu was the highest-ranked U.S. city at 26th place, followed by Pittsburgh at 30th
As I believe we have discussed here before, The Economist's ranking is sort of a "Places Professional-Class Brits Would Like" list, and there is a bit of a grass-is-greener effect which seems to favor Canadian and Australian cities over European cities.
Anyway, I find it is interesting Pittsburgh tends to do well in their list--I think it speaks to how although there are other affordable cities in the U.S., the cities specifically like Pittsburgh (in the relevant way) tend not to be affordable.
The Economist's ranking actually has a serious purpose--it it supposed to help guide international businesses when determining how much they should compensate their employees for being assigned to different cities (e.g., should they grant a "hardship allowance" if an employee is relocated to a certain city, and if so, how much).
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
