A different take on metro affordability. (Pittsburgh, Crafton: tax lien, for sale, foreclosure)

[Goodjules]

Originally Posted by h_curtis

Just did a quick search for single family homes in San Francisco and you can even buy a home for under $200K. Lets not get carried away with all this nonsense. Not every home in San Fran is a million bucks.

No, not all homes are $1 million, but most single family homes 2-3 bedrooms are well north of $500k. Under $200k in SF and it's not a studio condo? An actual single family home? Show me the listing and I'll tell what the neighborhood is like.

Before I decided to buy in Crafton I was considering less expensive areas of SF. I was not considering the very worst areas, but transitional, less trendy neighborhoods. A few of the listings below are in better neighborhoods, but most are transitional areas. Here are some recent listings (note prices, square footage, and number of days on the market):

75 Greenwood
San Francisco, CA 94112
2 Beds, 1 Bath, 1257 Sq. Ft.
95 days on Redfin
MLS#: 399094
$699,000
Status: Changed from Contingent to Pending



244 Chester
San Francisco, CA 94132
2 Beds, 2 Baths, 1625 Sq. Ft.
25 days on Redfin
MLS#: 401399
$619,000
Status: Changed from Active to Pending



678 Edinburgh St
San Francisco, CA 94112
3 Beds, 1 Bath, 1487 Sq. Ft.
20 days on Redfin
MLS#: 401651
$549,000
Status: Changed from Active to Pending



245 Persia St
San Francisco, CA 94110
3 Beds, 1 Bath, 1725 Sq. Ft.
19 days on Redfin
MLS#: 401751
$578,000
Status: Changed from Active to Pending



174 Brighton Ave
San Francisco, CA 94112
6 Beds, 3.5 Baths, 1445 Sq. Ft.
5 days on Redfin
MLS#: 402155
$595,000
Status: Changed from Active to Pending



Sold on 10/22/12
379 Lisbon St
San Francisco, CA 94112
5 Beds, 3 Baths, 1763 Sq. Ft.
MLS#: 394726
$620,000



Sold on 10/19/12
235 Valdez Ave
San Francisco, CA 94127
3 Beds, 1 Bath, 1550 Sq. Ft.
MLS#: 400408
$814,000

[Moby Hick]

Originally Posted by h_curtis

Um, there is no money lost unless you are selling your home. Just like buying a stock at $50 and it goes to $25, you haven't lost any money yet. You lost equity, but that stock might be $70 in a month. Those that bought at the height of the market are going to get hit if they are selling or have to sell. Just putting things into perspective. No money is lost unless you have to sell.

That's the kind of thinking that kept the banks for going insolvent all at once a couple of years ago. There is something to it, but let's not take it too far. You have lost money, you just have not realized the loss. Try to borrow using those shares or that house as an asset and you'll be treated as if you'd lost the money. Besides, being trapped and unable to sell a house is a very bad place in which to be should you face a job loss, illness, or any other unexpected problem.

[gg]

Originally Posted by ferrarisnowday

I see no homes listed on Trulia (once filtering out the RealtyTrac scams) for less than $200K, only condos and "townhomes." There are a few homes listed for $200K on the nose, but they look rough enough that they would be like $15K here.

Please provide a home that is valued at $15K in a neighborhood that is not death or a shooting gallery. Thanks. I am an interested buyer. Also, I was using Trulia and had no problem finding affordable homes in San Fran. I heard it is amazing there and think about how close you are to wine country!

Anyway, sometimes I wonder. Problem is.... I love Pittsburgh people. Well at least the older set. I am not a fan of the newbies much. That changed the driving here for the WORSE! I think the west coast could be great, but I am not sure they would be as friendly as the old set in Pittsburgh. I do think they would be as friendly as the new set since they are more like NJ/NYC metro types.

[Goodjules]

Originally Posted by Moby Hick

That's the kind of thinking that kept the banks for going insolvent all at once a couple of years ago. There is something to it, but let's not take it too far. You have lost money, you just have not realized the loss. Try to borrow using those shares or that house as an asset and you'll be treated as if you'd lost the money. Besides, not being trapped and unable to sell a house is a very bad place in which to be should you face a job loss, illness, or any other unexpected problem.

That's true. But, San Francisco proper has rebounded and it never lost much value to begin with. The older Bay Area suburbs (other than Oakland, EPA, and lower income neighborhoods in most Bay Area towns) in the entire Bay Area fared pretty well in the downturn as well. I however, lived in one of those lower income areas that was hard hit. I bought my ex-husband out at the top of the market when we were divorcing and I lost the house when the market crashed. Had I lived in a different neighborhood or bought the house at a different point in the market, I probably wouldn't be moving to Pittsburgh now. But I am priced out of San Francisco and most of the suburbs within a 30 mile radius.

[gg]

Originally Posted by juliegt

That's true. But, San Francisco proper has rebounded and it never lost much value to begin with. The older Bay Area suburbs (other than Oakland, EPA, and lower income neighborhoods in most Bay Area towns) in the entire Bay Area fared pretty well in the downturn as well. I however, lived in one of those lower income areas that was hard hit. I bought my ex-husband out at the top of the market when we were divorcing and I lost the house when the market crashed. Had I lived in a different neighborhood or bought the house at a different point in the market, I probably wouldn't be moving to Pittsburgh now. But I am priced out of San Francisco and most of the suburbs within a 30 mile radius.

So it is the bridge you will be crossing to get there. Buying someone out and incurring MASSIVE debt ratios is bad thinking, but not everyone knows how to handle money. Probably only 5% of people understand money. Hope you recover someday. Save and stay out of debt. Once the banks own you, you are indeed owned. I mean there are people on here that think reverse mortgages are a good deal. Look that up and the massive fraud going on!

[Goodjules]

Originally Posted by h_curtis

So it is the bridge you will be crossing to get there. Buying someone out and incurring MASSIVE debt ratios is bad thinking, but not everyone knows how to handle money. Probably only 5% of people understand money. Hope you recover someday. Save and stay out of debt. Once the banks own you, you are indeed owned. I mean there are people on here that think reverse mortgages are a good deal. Look that up and the massive fraud going on!

Once you lose the house, you lose the mortgage debt. Kind of a silver lining.

BTW: the debt ratio wasn't bad when I bought him out. It became bad when the market crashed.

And, I have recovered. I'm leaving the land of expensive housing and going to a place where my cost of living will drop by almost 2/3. My money will go a lot further there.

[ferraris]

Originally Posted by h_curtis

Please provide a home that is valued at $15K in a neighborhood that is not death or a shooting gallery. Thanks. I am an interested buyer. Also, I was using Trulia and had no problem finding affordable homes in San Fran. I heard it is amazing there and think about how close you are to wine country!

Anyway, sometimes I wonder. Problem is.... I love Pittsburgh people. Well at least the older set. I am not a fan of the newbies much. That changed the driving here for the WORSE! I think the west coast could be great, but I am not sure they would be as friendly as the old set in Pittsburgh. I do think they would be as friendly as the new set since they are more like NJ/NYC metro types.

I clearly said that those homes were in rough condition and did not mention neighborhoods. The type of neighborhood isn't relevant, as you didn't mention the type of neighborhood for the supposed homes in San Francisco listed for less than $200K that aren't condos or townhomes. If you search for homes $15K or less in Pittsburgh, you'll get results. Yes they will be rough in both location and condition, but San Francisco didn't return any single family homes for less than $200K, regardless of condition or neighborhood.

[Hopes]

Originally Posted by juliegt

Once you lose the house, you lose the mortgage debt. Kind of a silver lining.

The huge tax you have to pay on the mortgage balance is harsh though.

Originally Posted by juliegt

BTW: the debt ratio wasn't bad when I bought him out. It became bad when the market crashed.

I was just about the point that out to him. It was a good financial move before the value of the house tanked.

Originally Posted by juliegt

And, I have recovered. I'm leaving the land of expensive housing and going to a place where my cost of living will drop by almost 2/3. My money will go a lot further there.

Because you know how to handle money!

[sealie]

Originally Posted by ferrarisnowday

I clearly said that those homes were in rough condition and did not mention neighborhoods. The type of neighborhood isn't relevant, as you didn't mention the type of neighborhood for the supposed homes in San Francisco listed for less than $200K that aren't condos or townhomes. If you search for homes $15K or less in Pittsburgh, you'll get results. Yes they will be rough in both location and condition, but San Francisco didn't return any single family homes for less than $200K, regardless of condition or neighborhood.

I was curious about this myself. What I found is foreclosures, auctions, and lots/land. Oh, and a single SFH, with "some walls and flooring removed". With pictures. OY.
This is it:
1055 Gilman Avenue, San Francisco CA - Trulia
Not one of your better neighborhoods, but that goes without saying. Sold in 2005 for $450k I might add; taxes are 5,566.

[eschaton]

When I looked on Trulia, the only SFH in SF for under $300,000 seemed to be in and around Hunters Point (which historically was a ghetto, but is finally now gentrifying), and most were actually the starting price on a bank-owned property up for auction.