Amtrak Pennsylvanian service may end (Philadelphia, Pittsburgh: theater, public transportation, food)

[ny789987]

Originally Posted by I_Like_Spam

Its not so much the wages that Amtrak pays that makes it inefficient, but the great expanses that it has to cover in America. Its over 400 miles by rail to Philadelphia, and that's just a small part of the US. England and Europe are much smaller, much more densely populated, rail makes sense there.

In addition, Amtrak has its stations in downtown areas, the American population is spread out a lot more from the central cities than places in Europe and Japan. Towns like NYC are exceptions to the rule.

Making it from Marshall or Cranberry to the airport isn't any more difficult than making it to the Amtrak station in town.

The vast distances make it more expensive to maintain because of the extra miles and make it less convenient for people to actually utilize the service cutting down on patronage.

That is incorrect. The overwhelming majority of the tracks and infrastructure that Amtrak rolls over are owned by private freight corporations. (BNSF, Union Pacific, etc.). Amtrak loses money because of its inefficient govt union makeup.

[pman]

Originally Posted by Goinback2011

Is an Amtrak worker a federal employee?

no, Amtrak is a private for profit corporation mostly owned by the federal government and certainly micromanaged by the feds. the board of directors, though, is wholly appointed by the feds.
Federal law dictates that trains that do not travel 750 miles be paid for by the states. the absurdity of a law that says you can lose $60 million running chicago to emeryville but you can't lose $3.5 million running NY-Pittsburgh should be obvious.

anyway, aside from general Amtrak rants does anyone actually oppose a second train? Ridership at PGH has been growing the past few years, the station is well located, and the second train could begin a long overdue revival of passenger rail in the region. Generally speaking ridership at Amtrak is increasingly oriented toward the NEC including both the NEC trains but also feeder routes such as service to Pittsburgh and VA. Regardless of what happens at amtrak I think this is a good move (though I reserve the right to criticize whenever Amtrak comes up with a price). On October 5th the Keystone will hae a new schedule, long overdue, that I believe will reduce the state operating subsidy on that end which gives me hope that the new proposal will be reasonable.

I do think the state should outsource the cafe operation to a PA company offering PA products

[ny789987]

Does anyone regularly take Amtrak on here? I could see how it could work for an overnight trip to Chicago, but what about New York City? Isn't megabus faster, cheaper, and more convenient?

[UKyank]

Originally Posted by ny789987

Does anyone regularly take Amtrak on here? I could see how it could work for an overnight trip to Chicago, but what about New York City? Isn't megabus faster, cheaper, and more convenient?

I took it once to philly because i happened to have a long weekend I had to be there for - the train is nice; conveniently gets you in the city center (kind of anyways) but being that it eats an entire day of travel you really need an open schedule to make use of it.

I looked into using the route to Chicago before as it actually conveniently goes overnight but the cost of a lay down seat vs an hr flight was so ridiculous I've only flown.

They're just not competitive in too many ways to be a real option to many.

[Goinback2011]

Slower and more expensive. What's not to like?

[pman]

Originally Posted by ny789987

Does anyone regularly take Amtrak on here? I could see how it could work for an overnight trip to Chicago, but what about New York City? Isn't megabus faster, cheaper, and more convenient?

Ny is a long ride on megabus...too long for my taste. Amtrak is a bit longer but way more comfortable with the ability to walk around. My normal pair is philly pittsburgh but the schedule doesn't always suit my needs both because it's slow and it only runs once a day. In my travels I notice it often sells out to altoona which I believe is because it's reasonably competitive there. The time is lost going to lewistown.

Chicago trip time is also competitive with driving but the overnight schedule is undesirable unless you spring for a sleeper which is more expensive than flying. That being said amtrak has well located stations in ny, philly, and especially pittsburgh. ..and the hotel boom downtown is only improving that situation. Ultimately trip time needs to be improved but this is step one.
Eta: chicago used to be on the wrong side of the river but development around the station has exploded

Fwiw fares are set by penndot on the pennsylvanian

[gg]

Originally Posted by Goinback2011

Is an Amtrak worker a federal employee?

Might as well be since they are on the taxpayer's dime. As soon as you attach taxes to anything, watch the waste begin. It is amazing!

[ny789987]

Originally Posted by pman

Ny is a long ride on megabus...too long for my taste. Amtrak is a bit longer but way more comfortable with the ability to walk around. My normal pair is philly pittsburgh but the schedule doesn't always suit my needs both because it's slow and it only runs once a day. In my travels I notice it often sells out to altoona which I believe is because it's reasonably competitive there. The time is lost going to lewistown.

Chicago trip time is also competitive with driving but the overnight schedule is undesirable unless you spring for a sleeper which is more expensive than flying. That being said amtrak has well located stations in ny, philly, and especially pittsburgh. ..and the hotel boom downtown is only improving that situation. Ultimately trip time needs to be improved but this is step one.

I checked online and it looks like the PGH-NYC run eats up the entire day. Even though train travel is more comfortable, I doubt I am going to waste an entire day of a long weekend sitting on a train. I could jump in my car after work and be there that same night. Looks like the only way the train beats the convenience and cost of the airplane or automobile is if there is an overnight with a sleeper option. Amtrak needs to offer a mid-range sleeper option. Europe and Asia have 2nd class sleeper accommodations, America should do the same. Pittsburgh would greatly benefit. Think of the hordes of foreign tourists that line the sidewalks of nyc/dc; Some even might visit downtown Pittsburgh! This is all a pipe dream however, as we all know whatever meager subsidies Amtrak receives in the future will be wasted on $40 an hour food cart operators and high speed trains to nowhere in the California desert.

[pman]

Amtrak is not involved in the California project. Ny is a long drive as well and the airfare is not competitive on that trip. Adding service is really the only way. Penndot is free to outsource cafe attendants and while 40/hrs is a lot they don't cost millions (ftr I actually think outsourcing food is a good idea, amtrak has already outsourced the back end to Aramark). The only way forward is to add service. You may not personally use it but others do since the trains are pretty full. The more service you add the more it makes sense for the state to invest in the infrastructure. They made it crystal clear at the public meeting that it doesn't make sense to invest in track improvements for one a day...of course track improvements are key to lowering losses (if you can turn a train the same day that cafe attendant now works two revenue shifts in one day)

[pman]

I'd add that I typically show up ten minutes (or less) ahead of departure and find ticketing as convenient as an airline minus the fees...at least since ticketing went electronic a few years ago.boarding procedures are another story