How would Pittsburgh be different if we ended up in WV? (Philadelphia: houses, school)

[Hopes]

My mother was from West Virginia. That means half of my extended family is down there.

[Herodotus]

Would have made the split of the state much more interesting. I don't know what Virginia's population numbers looked like at the time of the Civil War, but adding the Pittsburgh region would have greatly affected the politics of the state, giving the western half much more clout.

Wheeling wouldn't have become important, as Pittsburgh would have filled the role that Wheeling did for Virginia. Allegheny would have become the focus of Harrisburg, and of Philadelphia interests, and would have rivaled Pittsburgh for size and importance, giving us a true "twin cities" situation.

[eschaton]

Originally Posted by Q-tip motha

If Pittsburgh were part of WV its likely that Wheeling would've remained the state capitol, as opposed to Charleston.

Morgantown would probably be the best, just judging by physical location.

Originally Posted by Q-tip motha

I feel that its also possible that given its influence Pittsburgh could possibly have ended up as the capitol proper.

It's possible, but not too many states picked a capitol not located in a fairly central location, and the ones which didn't (Massachusetts, Florida, Virginia) largely didn't because they stuck with the historic capitol even after the population center shifted.

Originally Posted by Q-tip motha

Pittsburgh wouldn't be all that different than it is today, as the features that made it an industrial giant would exist regardless. Its more likey that WV would have been influenced more over time from the association. The regional accent would probably extend further south, with less of a twang in the voices of central WV.

I mostly agree. The mixture of settlers from Virginia and Philadelphia who settled the area and gave it the initial Scotch-Irish influenced accent would come here regardless.

Originally Posted by Tinare

We'd say "y'all" instead of "yinz"?

The formation started from the same route - Scotch Irish. Ulster Scots had a second person plural, which, for Scots-Irish speaking English, translated into either "you all" or "you ones." You all became yall, you ones became yunz, and eventually yinz.

Originally Posted by pman

an interesting question is whether it would have ever become a major city the way it did as part of the then booming Pennsylvania or if it would have ended up more like a roanoke or...charleston.

It's got everything needed in terms of river access and natural resources. I don't see why it would flounder, since the building up of it was largely not due to the efforts of state government. Certainly PA will focus efforts on Allegheny City though, which will result in it being more built up of an area than IOTL.

Originally Posted by Herodotus

Would have made the split of the state much more interesting. I don't know what Virginia's population numbers looked like at the time of the Civil War, but adding the Pittsburgh region would have greatly affected the politics of the state, giving the western half much more clout.

Indeed. I would see West Virginia as being seen as much more similar of a state today as Missouri - well known for a big rust-belt city, along with the stark differences between Pittsburgh's environs and rural West Virginia.

Originally Posted by Herodotus

Wheeling wouldn't have become important, as Pittsburgh would have filled the role that Wheeling did for Virginia. Allegheny would have become the focus of Harrisburg, and of Philadelphia interests, and would have rivaled Pittsburgh for size and importance, giving us a true "twin cities" situation.

Allegheny City will be pretty interesting. I can't see it expanding much further than the OTL Northside of Pittsburgh in terms of territory (maybe taking in Millvale, Bellevue, and Avalon). Still, the state will be putting a lot more infrastructure investment into Allegheny City than OTL's northside.

It gets more interesting, assuming the world mostly is otherwise the same, come the 1950s. I'm presuming Pennsylvania would not allow Allegheny City to be destroyed for highways. Also, assuming something like the outflux of African-Americans from the Hill District happens, it's likely that far less end up in the North Side, as the Housing Authority of Pittsburgh won't be building any projects there. Thus you might end up with a mostly intact, overwhelmingly white Allegheny City (which starts gentrifying early), with Pittsburgh itself having a higher black population - perhaps approaching a 50/50 city like Cleveland or Saint Louis.

[creepsinc]

it would be whiter, so people on city-data would probably complain about it less.

[eschaton]

Originally Posted by creepsinc

it would be whiter, so people on city-data would probably complain about it less.

Why would it be whiter?

Do you think because it's in West Virginia, a black population wouldn't migrate there for jobs?

[sskink]

Assuming all else was equal going forward, Pitt would be in the B1G and I might not be whining about the PLCB.

[Copanut]

I love WV, anytime I go there I am automatically smart, good looking, and skinny!!!

[Aqua Teen Carl]

ITT: people who brag about Pittsburghers being friendly and forward thinking bashing their neighbors 1 state over.

[Clint.]

How would WV ended up if Pittsburgh were in it?

I don't think it would be much different culturally. Pittsburgh may be a bit more conservative than it is now, but don't think it would be radical change. Philadelphia is what makes PA more politically Democratic/moderate/liberal. The lack of a city the size of Pittsburgh in WV is what gives it the reputation for being the way it is politically; urban areas the size of Pittsburgh, in addition to being centers of economic activity and wealth, are usually politically moderate to liberal no matter what state they are in (including one like Texas). Some states just don't have urban areas large enough to impart that political flavor, and WV is one of those.

West Virginia saw some major labor wars over coal mining, more deadly than ones that happened over steel in Pittsburgh, and with two major industries (steel and coal) labor may have remained a stronger force for longer in the new state. Pittsburgh would have contributed more financially to WV, so it would have made WV a more prosperous state.

[LIRefugee]

I think it more likely that Pittsburgh/Allegheny would have been more like Philadelphia/ Camden or St Louis/East St Louis than something like New York/Brooklyn. Either way, Allegheny would definitely have been second banana.