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Old 06-14-2010, 05:03 PM
 
Location: Terra firma
1,372 posts, read 1,548,615 times
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The primary leaders of the so-called founding fathers of our nation were not Bible-believing Christians; they were deists. Deism was a philosophical belief that was widely accepted by the colonial intelligentsia at the time of the American Revolution. Its major tenets included belief in human reason as a reliable means of solving social and political problems and belief in a supreme deity who created the universe to operate solely by natural laws. The supreme God of the Deists removed himself entirely from the universe after creating it. They believed that he assumed no control over it, exerted no influence on natural phenomena, and gave no supernatural revelation to man. A necessary consequence of these beliefs was a rejection of many doctrines central to the Christian religion. Deists did not believe in the virgin birth, divinity, or resurrection of Jesus, the efficacy of prayer, the miracles of the Bible, or even the divine inspiration of the Bible.

These beliefs were forcefully articulated by Thomas Paine in the "Age of Reason", a book that so outraged his contemporaries that he died rejected and despised by the nation that had once revered him as "the father of the American Revolution." To this day, many mistakenly consider him an atheist, even though he was an out spoken defender of the Deistic view of God. Other important founding fathers who espoused Deism were George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, Benjamin Franklin, Ethan Allen, James Madison, and James Monroe.

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sourc...bdP6TOe94-WdEQ

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sourc...AQxc0amutAeYOQ

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sourc...GC-4pNQ2UI-5cg
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Old 06-14-2010, 05:13 PM
 
Location: NE Ohio
30,419 posts, read 20,299,216 times
Reputation: 8958
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zekester View Post
The primary leaders of the so-called founding fathers of our nation were not Bible-believing Christians; they were deists. Deism was a philosophical belief that was widely accepted by the colonial intelligentsia at the time of the American Revolution. Its major tenets included belief in human reason as a reliable means of solving social and political problems and belief in a supreme deity who created the universe to operate solely by natural laws. The supreme God of the Deists removed himself entirely from the universe after creating it. They believed that he assumed no control over it, exerted no influence on natural phenomena, and gave no supernatural revelation to man. A necessary consequence of these beliefs was a rejection of many doctrines central to the Christian religion. Deists did not believe in the virgin birth, divinity, or resurrection of Jesus, the efficacy of prayer, the miracles of the Bible, or even the divine inspiration of the Bible.

These beliefs were forcefully articulated by Thomas Paine in the "Age of Reason", a book that so outraged his contemporaries that he died rejected and despised by the nation that had once revered him as "the father of the American Revolution." To this day, many mistakenly consider him an atheist, even though he was an out spoken defender of the Deistic view of God. Other important founding fathers who espoused Deism were George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, Benjamin Franklin, Ethan Allen, James Madison, and James Monroe.

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sourc...bdP6TOe94-WdEQ

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sourc...AQxc0amutAeYOQ

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sourc...GC-4pNQ2UI-5cg
Your post is nothing but bald faced lies. Read some real history, and learn the truth.
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Old 06-14-2010, 05:16 PM
 
Location: Terra firma
1,372 posts, read 1,548,615 times
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Originally Posted by nononsenseguy View Post
Your post is nothing but bald faced lies. Read some real history, and learn the truth.
This is real history and it's your kind that wallows in lies. I understand though, the truth is often troubling which is why most people run from it.
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Old 06-14-2010, 06:12 PM
 
Location: Terra firma
1,372 posts, read 1,548,615 times
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Th espousal of Christianity in recognition of the utility of its teachings is not the same thing as adopting it as your personal faith.

I pose a challenge to anyone who can offer a quote from a primary source of founding fathers George Washington, Ben Franklin, Thomas Jefferson, or Thomas Paine actually claiming to be Christian.
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Old 06-14-2010, 06:16 PM
 
23,838 posts, read 23,117,461 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zekester View Post
Th espousal of Christianity in recognition of the utility of its teachings is not the same thing as adopting it as your personal faith.

I pose a challenge to anyone who can offer a quote from a primary source of founding fathers George Washington, Ben Franklin, Thomas Jefferson, or Thomas Paine actually claiming to be Christian.
"While we are zealously performing the duties of good citizens and soldiers, we certainly ought not to be inattentive to the higher duties of religion. To the distinguished character of Patriot, it should be our highest glory to add the more distinguished character of Christian."
The Writings of Washington, pp. 342-343

"The general principles on which the fathers achieved independence were the general principles of Christianity. I will avow that I then believed, and now believe, that those general principles of Christianity are as eternal and immutable as the existence and attributes of God."
Adams wrote this on June 28, 1813, in a letter to Thomas Jefferson

"I am a real Christian – that is to say, a disciple of the doctrines of Jesus Christ."
The Writings of Thomas Jefferson, p. 385.

PSSSSSHHHH...That was too easy Zeke.

Founding Fathers Quotes - Christian Quotes of the Founding Fathers

Can we close this thread now?
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Old 06-14-2010, 06:18 PM
 
11,155 posts, read 15,702,787 times
Reputation: 4209
Quote:
Originally Posted by nononsenseguy View Post
Your post is nothing but bald faced lies. Read some real history, and learn the truth.
Just curious - what was not truthful in his post? Just read some of Thomas Jefferson's rants against Christianity or his rewritten Bible or George Washington's and Ben Franklin's writings for that matter.

Certainly put faith in a higher power, that that is far from ascribing to Christianity.
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Old 06-14-2010, 06:21 PM
 
11,155 posts, read 15,702,787 times
Reputation: 4209
Quote:
Originally Posted by AeroGuyDC View Post
"While we are zealously performing the duties of good citizens and soldiers, we certainly ought not to be inattentive to the higher duties of religion. To the distinguished character of Patriot, it should be our highest glory to add the more distinguished character of Christian."
The Writings of Washington, pp. 342-343

"The general principles on which the fathers achieved independence were the general principles of Christianity. I will avow that I then believed, and now believe, that those general principles of Christianity are as eternal and immutable as the existence and attributes of God."
Adams wrote this on June 28, 1813, in a letter to Thomas Jefferson

"I am a real Christian – that is to say, a disciple of the doctrines of Jesus Christ."
The Writings of Thomas Jefferson, p. 385.

PSSSSSHHHH...That was too easy Zeke.

Founding Fathers Quotes - Christian Quotes of the Founding Fathers

Can we close this thread now?
I think you grossly misunderstand what Thomas Jefferson was saying in that p. 385 quote. He was taking a jab at Christianity. I mean, the guy rewrote the entire Bible, removing all of the spiritual aspects and reducing Christ to a person who did some good things. He famiously ranted against priests and their efforts to influence the government with their religion.

You should study your history more on this subject. There's quite a bit - especially their passionate intention of keeping any one religion from controlling the government they were founding.
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Old 06-14-2010, 06:22 PM
 
23,838 posts, read 23,117,461 times
Reputation: 9409
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluefly View Post
Just curious - what was not truthful in his post? Just read some of Thomas Jefferson's rants against Christianity or his rewritten Bible or George Washington's and Ben Franklin's writings for that matter.

Certainly put faith in a higher power, that that is far from ascribing to Christianity.
Do yourself a favor. Take a deep breath, get off your obviously inescapable contrarious high-horse for a moment, and do your research. If that's too much for you, simply scroll up and read the link I posted.
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Old 06-14-2010, 06:23 PM
 
23,838 posts, read 23,117,461 times
Reputation: 9409
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluefly View Post
I think you grossly misunderstand what Thomas Jefferson was saying in that p. 385 quote. He was taking a jab at Christianity. I mean, the guy rewrote the entire Bible, removing all of the spiritual aspects and reducing Christ to a person who did some good things.

You should study your history more on this subject. There's quite a bit - especially their passionate intention of keeping any one religion from controlling the government they were founding.
At least click on the link if you're going to make ridiculous remarks. Because you just embarrassed yourself to great magnitudes.
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Old 06-14-2010, 06:31 PM
 
23,838 posts, read 23,117,461 times
Reputation: 9409
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zekester View Post
Th espousal of Christianity in recognition of the utility of its teachings is not the same thing as adopting it as your personal faith.

I pose a challenge to anyone who can offer a quote from a primary source of founding fathers George Washington, Ben Franklin, Thomas Jefferson, or Thomas Paine actually claiming to be Christian.
Outside of the actual premise, one of the funnier parts of your post is that you limited the debate to four of the original signers of our founding documents! Why is that? lol
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