Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
The "automatic citizenship" they are referring to is not the citizenship with with which Obama was born. It is referring to "British Citizenship" (only one of several forms of British nationality) as currently recognized under the British Nationality Act 1981, which came into force on 1 January 1983. The reference to "automatic citizenship" is if you automatically became a citizen on 1 January 1983 based on the citizenship you held on December 31, 1982.
Ignoring that Obama was not a child then and so your ripped-out-of-context "soundbite" was irrelevant to him out of the gate, here are those requirements:
Quote:
If you were born outside the United Kingdom before 1 January 1983
If you were born outside the United Kingdom before 1 January 1983, you became a British citizen if, immediately before that date, you were a citizen of the United Kingdom and Colonies and had the right of abode in the United Kingdom.
You may have had citizenship of the United Kingdom and Colonies by descent from a father who had that citizenship, or because you were registered or naturalised as a citizen of the United Kingdom and Colonies.
Obama does not qualify for this, as he never had "the right of abode in the United Kingdom." His father did not have it either.
Quote:
If you have a passport issued before 1 January 1983 that describes you as a citizen of the United Kingdom and Colonies on page 1, you will almost certainly have become a British citizen on 1 January 1983 as long as page 5 says 'Holder has the right of abode in the United Kingdom'.
Obama has never possessed a British Passport.
Quote:
However, if you had the right of abode because you were registered under the British Nationality (No2) Act 1964, you will not normally have become a British citizen on 1 January 1983 unless your mother became a British citizen then.
Obama was not a citizen under the 1964 Act, since his mother was never a British Citizen at all.
Quote:
You may have had right of abode if:
- you were adopted, naturalised or registered as a citizen of the United Kingdom and Colonies in the United Kingdom (except in certain circumstances);
As you seem to agree... Obama was not registered. So he does not qualify here.
Quote:
- you had been legally settled in the United Kingdom and ordinarily resident there for five years; or
Obam has never lived in the UK.
Quote:
- when you were born, you had a parent who was a citizen of the United Kingdom and Colonies because he/she was born, adopted, naturalised or registered in the United Kingdom (except in certain circumstances), or because one of your grandparents was.
Obama's father was not born in the United Kingdom. He was born in the British Overseas territories.
Obama does not qualify for the exception from Registration.
Do you consider "alien" and "foreigner" to be synonyms?
I concur with the definition of "foreigner" noted in the UC Berkeley Journal article I posted. The known definition when the US Constitution was drafted:
foreigner: foreign-born, or more specifically, is a foreign citizen or subject
....and as we know in jay's time, as with today, there are multiple definitions of "foreigner". some support your theory some don't. we have no way of knowing which definition jay was referring to.
Interestingly, the question posed to Gabby by Jared was, "If words have no meaning, how can you have Government?"
Can you not read, man? Obama was born in 1961. He's subject to the British Nationality Act of 1948. Even Organizing for America admits that.
And as a result never was and never became a "British Citizen" at all.
"British Citizen" is only one of several forms of British Nationality. You know that right?
Prior to 1 January 1983 he was a "Citizen of the United Kingdom and Colonies."
On that date he did not "automatically become a British Citizen" (which is the specific nationality exempted in your ripped-out-of-context "soundbite.") He became a "British Overseas Citizen." This is a different specific nationality, and not covered by your cited exemption for Registration.
And of course, since Obama is not a child, that exemption was hardly relevant to him anyway.
I concur with the definition of "foreigner" noted in the UC Berkeley Journal article I posted. The known definition when the US Constitution was drafted:
foreigner: foreign-born, or more specifically, is a foreign citizen or subject
Do you consider "alien" and "foreigner" to be synonyms?
I did. You just don't want to accept the answer. Again, I'll refer you to the Italian Consulate to support my position. One born outside Italy does not automatically acquire Italian citizenship. Italy, through their Consulates, requires extensive documentation, including long form birth certificates, to determine if one is even eligible for Italian citizenship.
Indeed I do know. Italian citizenship requires much more extensive documentation than Obama provided to 'claim' eligibility to be POTUS and CIC. That's irony.
No. That's different requirements for different things.
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent
irony: incongruity between the actual result of a sequence of events and the normal or expected result.
And no such incongruity exists. Nobody with more than a brain stem would have expected the requirements for recognition of Italian citizenship and eligibility for the American Presidency to be even vaguely similar.
I did. You just don't want to accept the answer. Again, I'll refer you to the Italian Consulate to support my position. One born outside Italy does not automatically acquire Italian citizenship. Italy, through their Consulates, requires extensive documentation, including long form birth certificates, to determine if one is even eligible for Italian citizenship.
And what does that have to do with the question? It had nothing to do with Italy at all. Here it is again.
If Obama wanted a British passport, would he have to apply for it?
No court has ruled on merit. They refuse to consider merit, claiming that US citizens do not have standing to question the eligibility of their elected officials.
Standing is the first merit.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Obama was born in 1961. He's subject to the British Nationality Act of 1948. Even Organizing for America admits that.
eligibility to be POTUS and CIC. That's irony.
