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Thing is, I've never seen a study about being black or not. I've seen studies "choose or born" gay.
Sexuality and Gender are far far more complicated than skin color. In fact, sexuality is one of if not the most complicated biological aspects of humans. It's a heck of a lot harder to study and analyze.
explain?
unlike you I actually take Judaism very seriously and don't abandon it.
Quote:
down right illogical that intelligent discussion is pointless with you
what is illogical about this
1. according to you New Zealand has more gay "rights" then the USA
2. kosher meat is banned in New Zealand (from a liberal Israeli paper (you might not trust something more right wing)) New Zealand outlaws kosher slaughter - Haaretz Daily Newspaper | Israel News
3. banning kosher meat is Anti Semetic.
4. the united states doesn't ban kosher meat.
5. New Zealand is a more pro gay then the US but is more Anti Semitic.
Right, because it's not like gays haven't been murdered or had attempted genocide against them for being gay or anything. Gays can't possibly have suffered throughout the world like slaves owned by Christians
As have Christians, fat people, ugly people, skinny people, mentally disabled people, etc; all people have been discriminated though out the course of history. But to equate gays with the civil rights movement is offensive. gay people can stay in the closet and no one would know that they're gay. You very well can't hide the fact that you're black.
You do know 10s of thousands of gays were killed in the Holocaust for being gay right? Uganda, a country with a higher percentage of Christians than the US is attempting to pass a "kill the gays" bill to execute or inprison anyone who is perceived as gay or even associates with gays. Countless gays have been murdered and assasinated in this country. Harvey Milk and Matthew Shepard ring any bells?
It's not outrageous at all. Gays have been grossly mistreated too. Why do we need to have a contest of who has suffered the worst?
Way to generalize. I'm a Messianic Jew. Do you know what that is? The Apostles were the first ones. I'm not anti Christian, I'm anti fundamentalist right wing crazies. And many gays are anti-Christian because of lies you fundamentalists keep spreading about them.
Matthew Shepard wasn't killed because he was gay, this myth was dispelled years ago, but unfortunately agendas often get in the way of the truth. He was a meth head and was killed by two bisexual dopers over a deal gone bad.
Matthew Shepard wasn't killed because he was gay, this myth was dispelled years ago, but unfortunately agendas often get in the way of the truth. He was a meth head and was killed by two bisexual dopers over a deal gone bad.
Two young men -- Russell Arthur Henderson and Aaron James McKinney -- were convicted in connection with the crime, with multiple witnesses testifying to their anti-gay aspect of the crime. Both also intended to rob the Sheppard home after the attack, according to press accounts.
McKinney testified that Shepard attempted to grab his leg earlier in the evening and that had spurred a "gay panic" that provoked an extraordinarily violent outburst -- with his lawyers claiming McKinney had suffered homosexual abuse as a child.
Catholics are not a minority who were systematically wiped out through genocide. Gays are a very tiny minority. Of course less of them would be killed. I still don't see how you can claim the holocaust was less severe than slavery. Especially considering slavery was quite common and accepted in the Bible.
No, I'm pointing out that Uganda is predominantely Christian, meaning it's Christians trying to kill gays. They also have backing by prominent US Christian conservatives. I'm well aware Muslim countries kill gays too, and I condemn them for it.
And I don't know why you keep calling me a Christophobe, when I believe Yeshua haMessiach is our Savior. Logic fails on you.
Gays don't have more freedom in the US. They actually have some of least freedoms of any 1st world country. New Zealand, Australia, Canada, most of Europe, parts of South America, etc. all have far more gay rights than the US. There are 10 countries that allow Gay marriage, and quite a few others that allow civil unions. The US allows neither.
The only reason blacks were noticeably treated worse in the past is because they couldn't hide their skin color. Gays have basically remained closeted and hidden until recently because of how society treated them. It's easier to pull off being straight as a gay person than to pull off being non-black as a black person.
That doesn't change the fact that both groups have been grossly mistreated. Why are you trying to minimize the suffering of gays, when I'm not minimizing the suffering of the slaves? You are obviously a homophobe.
1. Catholics were a minority in the Third Reich who were targeted by the Nazis. You need to read your history again.
2. I am not making an assumption of moral equivilence between slavery and anything- you are.
3. Yes, you ARE saying that Christians are trying to kill gays, not Ugandans. Why? Obviously because you hate Christians. Now are Christians in the US, the UK and contiental europe slaughtering gays? If not, are they just getting warmed up, in your mind, to start doing so?
4. What about the Muslims killing gays (as a part of Islamic law). They seem to get a pass in your mind, yet the killing of gays in Islamic nations is not only smiled upon, IT IS THE LAW.
5. Gays have limited freedoms in the US???? Apparently you have never been to South America, Central America and Asia. I have never been to the Middle East or Africa, but they appear to make no qualms about killing gays.
6. Am I minimizing the suffering of gays? Yes. The claims you have made are outlandish and ridiculous.
7. Regarding skin color, I am afraid that I do not see your point. Again, you are actually suggesting that the plight of slavery is equivilent to the misery suffered by black slaves??????? Further, skin color is not a choice. Many would contend that sexual preference is a choice and thus the "misery" (in your mind) suffered by gays can be ameliorated by simply making another choice.
8. If the US is so terrible, just move. If I thought the US was as bad as you suggest, I would simply move to another nation. Just choose these gay meccas you note and start a residence there.
Here is the problem, however, most of our perceptions are due to the four inches between our ears, rather than the space around us. To paraphrase Paul Revere and the Raiders...."you see no matter what you do, you will never run away from you."
As have Christians, fat people, ugly people, skinny people, mentally disabled people, etc; all people have been discriminated though out the course of history. But to equate gays with the civil rights movement is offensive. gay people can stay in the closet and no one would know that they're gay. You very well can't hide the fact that you're black.
And the ability to hide their orientation somehow mitigates the prejudice against them?
And the ability to hide their orientation somehow mitigates the prejudice against them?
Uh.........yeah. If some anti-gay guy doesn't know that you're gay how can he discriminate against you? Again, blacks couldn't very well hide the fact that they were black, could they?
Religion's a helluva drug , (not intended for all religious just extremists)
Bideshi, I assume you're of Abrahamic faith please show us where in the 10 commandments does it say "Homosexuality is a sin" or anything of the like
Leviticus 18:22 Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination.
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