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Land Trusts still file taxes and even if they were corporations it wouldnt change a dam thing. Stock holders are OWNERS. Did you fail entry level business classes?
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Originally Posted by Cletus Awreetus-Awrightus
Right, because the land trust is not a corporation, you pay personal taxes on it.
No you dont.. You dont pay personal taxes until AFTER it leaves the trust. The Trust FIRST pays income taxes just like corporations do.
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Originally Posted by Cletus Awreetus-Awrightus
That's because you sold it, and have to pay capital gains on your gains. This is not a double tax.
I dont need to sell it to be liable for capital gains.. The INCOME is double taxed, first at the trust level and THEN under my tax returns. BOTH times its MY MONEY!!! Its DOUBLE TAXED.
You are missing the scope of the topic. I will be more clear and succinct. The Republican party caters to the very wealthy. The Democrat party attempts to cater to the middle class and the poor. Each parties policies reflect, which demographic that they cater to. The republican's tax plans are heavily slanted to favor the rich. Do you dispute that?
I do. Look at all the hundreds of billions 0bama gives away to the wealthy corporations. 0bama is the king of cronyism, and he definitely caters to the wealthy.
The dems don't cater to the poor, they play class warfare and pander to the poor. "Looky, looky, I have sweetmeats for you, vote for me or you won't get anymore". Every election the dems pander to the poor and elderly, fear mongering the lies that the mean repubs will take away their social security and Medicare, while at the same time the dems pass legislation that will take $500 billion out of Medicare.
The conservative republicans only look like they cater to the rich because they don't play the class warfare game, or fear monger by pitting one American against the other. I do admit that some of the neocons pander like the dems do.
The dems have perfected the game of treating multiple groups of Americans as the poor, dysfunctional, simple-minded waifs, while they stroke their heads and say "There, there, you poor, little thing, let me comfort you with these sweetmeats." Meanwhile, the conservative republican aren't out there pandering to all these same groups, and the dems make them out to be evil, uncaring ogres for not pandering like they do.
Land Trusts still file taxes and even if they were corporations it wouldnt change a dam thing.
It wouldn't change a thing, other than whether your argument made sense or not.
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Stock holders are OWNERS.
Owners of a corporation, which is why they are not being double taxed; they are not the corporation itself.
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No you dont.. You dont pay personal taxes until AFTER it leaves the trust. The Trust FIRST pays income taxes just like corporations do.
Net income is taxed either to the trust or to the beneficiaries, depending upon the trust terms, local law and, in the cases of complex trusts, whether the trust distributed the income.
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I dont need to sell it to be liable for capital gains
Yes you do. Capital gains are, by definition, gains from selling your holdings. They don't assess capital gains on that which was not a capital gain.
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.. The INCOME is double taxed
Income from a trust is not synonymous with a capital gain.
It wouldn't change a thing, other than whether your argument made sense or not.
Now you arent making any sense at all. I said your example wouldnt change a thing and you argued with me, now you are admitting I was correct.
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Originally Posted by Cletus Awreetus-Awrightus
Owners of a corporation, which is why they are not being double taxed; they are not the corporation itself.
Money going into a corporation IS THE OWNERS money. Do you not understand that? The fact that its a different entity doesnt change who the money belongs to.. For god sakes no one can be this ignorant..
If you own a corporation and die, that corporation is an asset of yours and passes to your estate because its YOURS.. it doesnt sit out in la la land just running itself
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Originally Posted by Cletus Awreetus-Awrightus
Net income is taxed either to the trust or to the beneficiaries, depending upon the trust terms, local law and, in the cases of complex trusts, whether the trust distributed the income.
No its not otherwise people could keep money in a trust and avoid inheritance taxes which they cant. At some point the money leaves the trust ont the owners/beneficiaries and is TAXED. If the trust makes a profit its taxed, then when its distributed to the owners, the very people that own the trust, its TAXED AGAIN. THATS DOUBLE TAXED.
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Originally Posted by Cletus Awreetus-Awrightus
Yes you do. Capital gains are, by definition, gains from selling your holdings. They don't assess capital gains on that which was not a capital gain.
Not necessarily, when you move assets you own to trusts they arent sold, they are simply transferr of ownership title. Furthermore, since 2003 long term stock dividends are taxed at capital gains rates without the need to sell the stock. There are lots of examples of capital gains paid without selling.
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Originally Posted by Cletus Awreetus-Awrightus
Income from a trust is not synonymous with a capital gain.
Trusts are created to hold assets and assets cant be bought unless you have some sort of income which was taxed.
Money going into a corporation IS THE OWNERS money.
And once it arrives, it is the corporation's money.
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The fact that its a different entity doesnt change who the money belongs to.
Actually, the fact that it now belongs to a different entity DOES change who the money belongs to. You gave the company your cash, in exchange for a share of ownership in the company.
It's not a savings account, it's an investment.
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If you own a corporation and die, that corporation is an asset of yours
No it isn't. The shares of ownership of the corporation are assets of yours. Legally the corporation itself isn't YOU, and never will be, even if you own all of its shares.
If you don't like this fact, then don't participate in the ownership of corporations and avoid it altogether.
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No its not otherwise people could keep money in a trust and avoid inheritance taxes which they cant.
An inheritor doesn't pay inheritance taxes on the net income of a trust.
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At some point the money leaves the trust ont the owners/beneficiaries and is TAXED.
It can, yes.
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If the trust makes a profit its taxed, then when its distributed to the owners, the very people that own the trust, its TAXED AGAIN. THATS DOUBLE TAXED.
In your example, if the trust and the individual are two different entities, then it is not double taxation, because two different entities are paying the taxes.
If the trust is in the name of an individual, then there is no tax payed upon distribution because there is no distribution.
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Not necessarily, when you move assets you own to trusts they arent sold, they are simply transferr of ownership title.
Transfer of ownership is the same thing as selling.
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Trusts are created to hold assets and assets cant be bought unless you have some sort of income which was taxed.
that's correct, Like I said: you are taxed on the income which you earned. You buy an asset. The asset goes up in value, and when you sell it, you are taxed on the gain.
That's not a double taxation, because the income you earned (or money you stole, or inherited, or whatever) to buy the asset are not the same funds as the gains you made after the sale.
Last edited by Cletus Awreetus-Awrightus; 11-09-2011 at 11:15 AM..
Actually the Democrats are the party of the rich. The richest voting districts donate the most money to the Dems. Those in the highest income bracket voted for Obama in 2008. Blue states are wealthier than red states. Wall Street donated tons of money to the Dems. Democrats represent the rich (as well as government employees/union members), Republicans are the party of the middle class.
What I learned by reading this thread is that I don't think a single poster actually took the time to read the OP's Rolling Stone article. That's a shame because the article is a really fascinating read. Instead everybody just descended to their prepackaged talking points of partisans making lame partisan statements more meant for bumper stickers than anything resembling a thoughtful debate. I don't think any poster in here did more than read the title of the thread, and maybe the one paragraph quoted in the OP. Arguing over an article without actually reading is foolish at the best of times.
Actually the Democrats are the party of the rich. The richest voting districts donate the most money to the Dems. Those in the highest income bracket voted for Obama in 2008. Blue states are wealthier than red states. Wall Street donated tons of money to the Dems. Democrats represent the rich (as well as government employees/union members), Republicans are the party of the middle class.
And yet it's the Democratic Party which does not hesitate to call for the richest Americans to pay their fair share...it appears they operate out of principle rather than pandering to their constituency, no?
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