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Old 01-29-2012, 10:13 AM
 
47,525 posts, read 69,707,823 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mackinac81 View Post
Because as Americans, we simply don't care enough about education to invest in it. And by "investing" I'm not necessarily talking about money, but the time and energy we spend in teaching our kids the important subjects and activities that make them a well rounded person.

Parents need to step up to the plate and politicians need to get a clue.
Except that we throw a whole lot more money at "education" than do countries that have students that are scoring way above ours.

Much of the problem in fact it the belief that simply throwing more money at it is the answer.

Education today is about social promotion of kids. The "no child gets ahead" because "no child gets behind", meaning that if one child isn't making it, none can be allowed to succeed -- that's not fair after all. It all has to be fair. The poorly performing schools get more money - and students are given laptops while the better performing schools are cut off from even getting books.

And incompetent teachers must be kept on the job.
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Old 01-29-2012, 10:15 AM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
86,052 posts, read 84,495,743 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
Except that we throw a whole lot more money at "education" than do countries that have students that are scoring way above ours.

Much of the problem in fact it the belief that simply throwing more money at it is the answer.

Education today is about social promotion of kids. The "no child gets ahead" because "no child gets behind", meaning that if one child isn't making it, none can be allowed to succeed -- that's not fair after all. It all has to be fair. The poorly performing schools get more money - and students are given laptops while the better performing schools are cut off from even getting books.

And incompetent teachers must be kept on the job.
Other countries separate academic from vocational.
We don't.
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Old 01-29-2012, 10:16 AM
 
47,525 posts, read 69,707,823 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mackinac81 View Post
Which, in a way, is also a problem. The achievement gap in this country is atrocious. It shouldn't be that a child in rural Minnesota gets an infinitely better education than a kid in rural Georgia.
Look at California. Not so long ago it had the top public schools in the country and has now fallen to the bottom. And it's not for lack of spending.
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Old 01-29-2012, 10:18 AM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
86,052 posts, read 84,495,743 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
Look at California. Not so long ago it had the top public schools in the country and has not fallen to the bottom. And it's not for lack of spending.
I agree. CA education used to be the best in the country.
Sad that it went downhill.
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Old 01-29-2012, 10:19 AM
 
Location: Lost in Texas
9,827 posts, read 6,937,526 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyTexan View Post
Other countries separate academic from vocational.
We don't.
I have been argueing this point forever. Not all students are college bound and we do still need brick masons, carpenters, electricians, plumbers, mechanics etc etc etc. Kids that are not college bound are basically left out of the equation. Very few districts still have vocational education programs and those that do are terribly underfunded.
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Old 01-29-2012, 10:34 AM
 
Location: Pensacola, Florida
753 posts, read 843,371 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VTHokieFan View Post
they *gasp* have vouchers.
Vouchers are a 'grass is greener' approach. Most private schools don't do any better at educating students than public schools.
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Old 01-29-2012, 10:59 AM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
86,052 posts, read 84,495,743 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by freightshaker View Post
I have been argueing this point forever. Not all students are college bound and we do still need brick masons, carpenters, electricians, plumbers, mechanics etc etc etc. Kids that are not college bound are basically left out of the equation. Very few districts still have vocational education programs and those that do are terribly underfunded.
And back when we did have the 2 tracks the US was in the top 10.
We did this to ourselves. But we won't admit defeat and go back.
Instead we'll ask for more money and better gadgets, food, counselors, tutors, etc. because gosh darn it..EVERY kid is college material.
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Old 01-29-2012, 11:04 AM
 
56,988 posts, read 35,206,841 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PcolaFLGuy View Post
Vouchers are a 'grass is greener' approach. Most private schools don't do any better at educating students than public schools.
I've heard that so often that i'm starting to believe it's true. I was about to put my son in a private school back when he was an 8th grader, and folks kept telling me that the local private schools were no better. I found it hard to believe at the time, but i'm starting to wonder.
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Old 01-29-2012, 11:07 AM
 
4,255 posts, read 3,480,513 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lifelongMOgal View Post
Disinterested and uninvolved parents
Federal standards and rewards system which encourages schools to teach to the test rather than teach for knowledge, understanding, and mastery of a subject.
The erasure of facts in some subjects and the replacement with that which is "politically correct".
Stressing that children should feel good about themselves instead of actually learning in school. Self esteem being held in higher regard than knowledge.
Stress on cultural studies and social engineering instead of literature, history, math & science.
Tying the hands of teacher as to how much they are allowed to control the behavior of students in the classroom.
Absence of teaching of problem based learning and critical thinking skills.

and the list goes on...............

Well thats a hell of a good start. Also teaching kids to pass a certain test instead of learning. Very few classes involve real world issues.
But your first sentance is the #1 reason.
Wanna find a good public school system, find one where the parents are involved in their kids education.
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Old 01-29-2012, 11:11 AM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
86,052 posts, read 84,495,743 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PcolaFLGuy View Post
Vouchers are a 'grass is greener' approach. Most private schools don't do any better at educating students than public schools.
Private schools aren't mandated to educate everyone. They can refuse, expel, retain based on grades/behavior.

Don't base your opinion by graduation rates because even failing kids in public school are promoted and graduated by a board that meets over the summer.
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