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Old 02-07-2012, 03:22 PM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
90,297 posts, read 120,779,853 times
Reputation: 35920

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cavaturaccioli View Post
It's a frank one. If you can't afford a car you take public transit. Or walk. If you can't afford health insurance, you take medicare/medicaid.
You cannot get medicare until you are 65 years old, assuming you paid into SS for at least 10 years. You have to be practically penniless to get medicaid as an adult with no kids.

HCPF:Medicaid Eligibility

You can dig through this link yourself. I've done it before.

Nothing is as simple as you think it is.
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Old 02-07-2012, 03:22 PM
 
Location: Staten Island, NY
6,476 posts, read 7,324,646 times
Reputation: 7026
Quote:
Originally Posted by walidm View Post
It is only now illegal to deny insurance for pre-existing conditions as well as drop folks from the rolls.

Some regulatory force was needed. The market is single-mindedly focused on one thing - service as it relates to maximum profit. Period.

Balance is a necessity and we only achieve it through prudent regulation with issues this large.
And that is not insurance. All that happens as a result is that the cost of care for those with pre-existing conditions is now borne by healthier people, all with the idea of making health insurance less and less affordable until the private market busts out. Then the government will be the only refuge -socialized medicine. The effects are already being felt by the healthier by way of increased premiums, co-pays, and limits. Prescriptions that used to be covered are now either being dropped from formularies or the insured needs pre-authorization to get the medicine. Health care is getting worse and it's because of government interference in the market place.
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Old 02-07-2012, 03:22 PM
 
Location: Martinsville, NJ
6,175 posts, read 12,940,454 times
Reputation: 4020
Quote:
Originally Posted by orogenicman View Post
...right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness....
The right to pursue happiness is not a guarantee you will grab hold of it, or that others will pay for it on your behalf.
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Old 02-07-2012, 03:23 PM
 
Location: West Coast of Europe
25,947 posts, read 24,749,338 times
Reputation: 9728
Quote:
Originally Posted by pghquest View Post
If food is a right, there is no need to work in order to obtain it.

So you think you should be able to just enter a grocery store and steal whatever you want because its your right to do so? Where is food listed in the Constitution?
I didn't say that. What is important to me is that no matter what happens, nobody starves. Preferably everyone has work so they can pay for food.

Your suggesting people only work in order not to starve to death is ridiculous. Most people work because they want to do something and feel bad when receiving something for free without any emergency.
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Old 02-07-2012, 03:25 PM
 
69,368 posts, read 64,118,301 times
Reputation: 9383
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neuling View Post
I didn't say that. What is important to me is that no matter what happens, nobody starves. Preferably everyone has work so they can pay for food.

Your suggesting people only work in order not to starve to death is ridiculous. Most people work because they want to do something and feel bad when receiving something for free without any emergency.
But you did say it because when you call something a right, then you entitled to it regardless of your ability to pay.
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Old 02-07-2012, 03:25 PM
 
3,423 posts, read 3,214,960 times
Reputation: 3321
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cavaturaccioli View Post
Even people who aren't sick? In any case, if everyone's paying, what's the problem?

You're not getting it: Health care is a service, not a right. Exercising a right creates no incumbency on another person, save non-interference. Either a doc, nurse, or tech has to work for free OR someone has to be compelled to pay the bill. That isn't a right, it's an entitlement.
What guarantee is there that people who aren't sick won't get sick. Right. Zero. Everyone gets sick or injured at some time or another in their lifetime. The government has a constiutional mandate to regulate interstate commerce whether there is a right or not to healthcare, particularly when it is in the best interest of its citizens to do so.
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Old 02-07-2012, 03:27 PM
 
Location: Staten Island, NY
6,476 posts, read 7,324,646 times
Reputation: 7026
Quote:
Originally Posted by orogenicman View Post
No sir. The new law is regulating the insurance industry, and mandating them to provide insurance for those who previous could not afford it or were previously denied because of pre-existing conditions. And yes, that mandate requires everyone to be insured in the same way that every state requires its citizens to have auto insurance as a requirement for driving a car on the roads. That requirement came about because the Federal government mandated it by threatening loss of Federal highway dollars to those that did not require it.

The fact is that it is constitutional to mandate that everyone have health insurance, and is, in fact, the only way everyone is going to get covered. And by the way, I've yet to see anywhere in the law where it says that you will lose your citizenship if you aren't covered.
When you force insurance companies to insure the sick you're making it something other than insurance. Insurance is the exchange of risk for premium. An already sick patient has no risk; they're already sick.
There are states and localities where you do not have to have insurance in order to drive.

If Obamacare becomes the law and you don't buy insurance you will be fined. If you don't pay the fine, men with guns will come to your house, take your stuff, and put you in jail.
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Old 02-07-2012, 03:27 PM
 
Location: West Coast of Europe
25,947 posts, read 24,749,338 times
Reputation: 9728
Quote:
Originally Posted by pghquest View Post
But you did say it because when you call something a right, then you entitled to it regardless of your ability to pay.
Your conclusion that a right to food would justify theft is wrong. Theft and purchase are by far not the only ways of obtaining something.
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Old 02-07-2012, 03:28 PM
 
3,423 posts, read 3,214,960 times
Reputation: 3321
Quote:
Originally Posted by pghquest View Post
What does society running around sick make it a right? I can think of a lot of things society runs around and does, like eating, do you think thats a right?
"...right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness"

Also "...promote the general welfare..."
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Old 02-07-2012, 03:30 PM
 
Location: Staten Island, NY
6,476 posts, read 7,324,646 times
Reputation: 7026
Quote:
Originally Posted by EinsteinsGhost View Post

.... if it ain't a right, the government has the authority to regulate it.
Only if it doesn't violate the Constitution.
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