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Old 05-12-2012, 11:31 PM
 
4,019 posts, read 3,951,133 times
Reputation: 2938

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Don't forget. The rate of US population growth is among the highest in the industrialized world. In the near future, the need for a modern, efficient form of transportation will be greater than ever. Can you imagine being stuck waiting for hours in an airport in the year 2030? When the population of the country is near 400 million?

Our miserably antiquated transportation system is stuck in the 1950s and not prepared for the future.




In 2008, the US Census Bureau projected future censuses as follows:[20]
  • 2010: 310,232,863
  • 2020: 341,386,665
  • 2030: 373,503,674
  • 2040: 405,655,295
  • 2050: 439,010,253
Demographics of the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

U.S. population growth is among the highest in industrialized countries,[10]

 
Old 05-13-2012, 12:11 AM
 
Location: Lafayette, Louisiana
700 posts, read 637,817 times
Reputation: 786
The gas tax does *not* fully fund road infrastructure. The gas tax amounts to 34.8% of revenue for highways. Even when combined with vehicle taxes and fees at 19.7%, that only amounts to 54.5%. Nearly half of revenue sources for the highway system are subsidized through general funds, bond issuance, and other taxes.

The airline industry is subsidized as well;

Who builds the airports?
Who pays for airport security?
Who pays for the FAA?

Not the airlines.

Why do HSR subsidies become an issue yet highway and airline industry subsidies don't?

Also quit pointing to Europe; We're behind quite a lot of other countries in this regard as well.

Turkish High Speed Rail, High Speed Rail of Turkey, H
 
Old 05-13-2012, 03:10 PM
 
Location: Humboldt Park, Chicago
3,503 posts, read 3,133,399 times
Reputation: 2597
Quote:
Originally Posted by roysoldboy View Post
There are several problems with what you desire. Europe and Japan are made up of much smaller geographic areas than the US is. Rail travel remained popular in both areas while air travel was taking over here. The HSR you are so excited about would have to be up and down our two coasts but tax money from the rest of us would have to pay for it.

Your way sounds so good but how long does it take from one coast to the other by rail today? How many lines are there that go from coast to coast? One poster mentioned that maintenance of runways is a lot cheaper than building and maintaining rails.

Do you have any idea how much it would cost to build totally new lines for your HSRs? Totally new road beds and rails would be needed since what we have can't stand up to 200 mph trains. I think you are thinking like an Obama socialist that those who don't get to use them will have to pay for the HSRs on the coasts.
Wouldn't the job creation of such an undertaking be an upside?
 
Old 05-13-2012, 03:22 PM
 
29,407 posts, read 21,999,290 times
Reputation: 5455
Are these jobs shovel ready like the last round?? We could pay folks to dig holes too. That is what a government subsidized high speed rail would end up being.
 
Old 05-13-2012, 03:44 PM
 
46,944 posts, read 25,972,151 times
Reputation: 29439
Quote:
Originally Posted by geofra View Post
If rail travel ever became as popular as air travel, rail travel would "suck" like air travel does now. IMHO
If only we had countries with both air and rail networks, then we could check to verify that sort of statement. Oh, wait..
 
Old 05-13-2012, 03:56 PM
 
Location: Humboldt Park, Chicago
3,503 posts, read 3,133,399 times
Reputation: 2597
Quote:
Originally Posted by KUchief25 View Post
Are these jobs shovel ready like the last round?? We could pay folks to dig holes too. That is what a government subsidized high speed rail would end up being.
I'm just saying that for all the bellyaching around here about how Obama isn't doing anything to create jobs, wouldn't you think those same folks would get behind initiatives that would create, you know, jobs? Otherwise it kind of looks like you're so hyper partisan that you're willing to cut off your nose to spite your face.
 
Old 05-13-2012, 03:58 PM
 
Location: Southern California
15,080 posts, read 20,468,357 times
Reputation: 10343
Quote:
Originally Posted by cisco kid View Post
Between the airsickness, bad food (if it is even offered), cramped seats, poor customer service, endless delays and cancellations, having to remove your shoes at the security gate and who knows what other items of clothing, being felt up and degraded by a bunch of power-mad TSA agents, flying in the US has become a form of sadomasochism and torture.

But people are still largely opposed to high-speed rail? Go figure.

...
Aside from airsickness, why would HSR not have these attributes?

[these are not arguments for HSR]
 
Old 05-13-2012, 06:35 PM
 
Location: On the Rails in Northern NJ
12,380 posts, read 26,845,984 times
Reputation: 4581
Actually Rail starting to come back and fast , and reaching profitability on most Networks. Some lines now cover 80% of the operation costs. If all Rail lines were brought up to modern standards they could be profitable , that's how its done in Asia , Europe and Australia. Lines that are old and well used are expensive to run due to maintenance costs. As for Rail Ridership if it continues to grow like it is , we will surpass 1930 levels which were the highest next year, it was also the peak of Rail in the US. Do I think Rail will fully comeback to 1930 levels no, but enough will come back to service the growing US population.
 
Old 05-13-2012, 06:52 PM
 
48,502 posts, read 96,827,890 times
Reputation: 18304
Mostly only cargo transport rail is econmical. Check the price of a commericial rail line to same destinations as flying. Way higher. People need to face facts if it could make money then investors would invest in it. We are broke and AmTrax shows its not self supportive.It was airlines travel that killed rain travel in this country in the first place.
 
Old 05-13-2012, 07:43 PM
 
4,019 posts, read 3,951,133 times
Reputation: 2938
Quote:
Originally Posted by MIKEETC View Post
Aside from airsickness, why would HSR not have these attributes?

[these are not arguments for HSR]
Amtrak already serves 30 million passengers a year. The TSA does not operate on Amtrak like it does on the airlines. The security measures on Amtrak aren't nearly as bad as they are on the airlines.

Have you ever heard of anyone hijacking a train? I haven't. Hijackings always happen on airplanes. Airplanes are much easier to hijack which is why they are always targeted. Trains are very long and have a lot of separate cars. Its very hard for terrorists to control all the cars and passengers on the train. But an airplane is much smaller so easier take control of the people on it because the passengers are all in one compartment, not spread out across many cars like on a train. In case of emergency or hijacking, its relatively easy to stop a train and get off of it because its already on the ground. When that happens the hijackers are screwed because then they have lost control. But when you are 20,000 feet in the air you are trapped. There is no way to get out, so you are at the mercy of the hijackers at all times.
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