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This topic has gone astray beyond any hope of getting back on topic.
Historically, the minimum wage was established in the 1930s to fight deflation, which tended to reduce wages and create a deflationary spiral down. It has also been used to boast wages of the lowest paid workers.
What the minimum wage should be as at least high enough so that a full-time minimum wage worker isn't still below the poverty line, because then they are still eligible for public support, such as Medicaid and SNAP -- which just means that the tax-payer is subsidizing corporate payrolls.
Alright then, what if minimum wage jobs could only be part time jobs? What if McDonalds, Walmart and any other minimum wage employer only could offer a maximum of 30 hours a week each to their employees? Would that make you happy?
The minimum wage rate is just fine for those in mindless menial jobs. And no young person should ever consider being a minimum wage worker for their WHOLE lives, let alone ever consider raising a family on that income. And our government shouldn't be enabling anyone to be able to.
Alright then, what if minimum wage jobs could only be part time jobs? What if McDonalds, Walmart and any other minimum wage employer only could offer a maximum of 30 hours a week each to their employees? Would that make you happy?
The minimum wage rate is just fine for those in mindless menial jobs. And no young person should ever consider being a minimum wage worker for their WHOLE lives, let alone ever consider raising a family on that income. And our government shouldn't be enabling anyone to be able to.
And what should unskilled young minimum wage workers do instead as they age out? Obviously older minimum wage workers didn't get your directive.
Apologies in advance, I didn't read this long arsed thread.
I was watching that show "The Men Who Built America" last night, a fascinating series about Rockefeller, Vanderbilt, and Carnegie, and how they shaped the industrial revolution.
It's particularly fascinating because it shows both the great and terrible side of unbridled capitaliasm. Great because these men were free to go forth and create massive change and infrastructure for the better, terrible because at some point they were so rich and powerful that profit seeking became a game to win at all costs - and the costs were the workforce. They were completely unregulated and therefore decided that they would pay much less for much more, decimating their workforce and making them work ridiculous hours for next to nothing, because they could and because the workers were in no position to refuse.
The factories were death traps. The workers couldn't feed their families, couldn't house themselves, lived a miserable, rotten existence.
The 3 titans were so powerful they bought the presidential election in 1896, so no one would stop them doing it.
The federal government eventually put a stop to it by introducing corporate regulations. The problem is, to people at the very top who are out of touch with mortal man, big business is a game and they're quite willing to sacrifice actual people to play it. There's no empathy with people on the ground. No empathy for anything really except profit increase. And I'm not whining or calling evil - it's just the way it is and human nature.
And eventually, without regulation (such as minimum wage and safe working conditions, EPA laws etc) you just end up shooting yourself in the foot as a society - for who is going to buy all these goods you produce if people can barely manage a bowl of soup for their kids? Who's going to pay for cleaning the dirty air and unusable water? Who's going to support those killed and maimed at their jobs? Because trust me, if they could get away with it, it ain't going to be the big corps to whom the bottom line is everything and the only thing.
Unskilled or not isn't the point. Affording "nice things" isn't the point. People need to at least make enough for their time worked to be able to live at least a subsistence life, regardless of what that job entails. Otherwise we all pay for that.
If you can't afford to pay your workers a living wage, then you can't afford to operate that business.
Doctors don't make min wage.
CPA's don't make min wage.
Engineers don't make min wage.
Tradespeople don't make min wage.
Companies can't hire people for a wage they aren't willing to work for.
Those all require skills which are expensive to obtain, therefore many people cannot obtain those skills.
So? If you can't become a doctor you become something else. I know somebody that used to work in retail and he improved his lot in life. Now he wasn't making min wage, maybe $18 or so, but he wanted to make more so he took a CDL class and had a job within 4 weeks. He didn't pay cash either.
Quote:
Originally Posted by FinsterRufus
Skilled service providers obviously aren't the issue. And tradespeople don't make minimum wage - anymore.
Nobody is going to pay alot if you don't have skills. A door greeter a WMT just has to have a pulse and a smile. With or without a min wage skilled people won't be making $7.00 an hour.
So? If you can't become a doctor you become something else. I know somebody that used to work in retail and he improved his lot in life. Now he wasn't making min wage, maybe $18 or so, but he wanted to make more so he took a CDL class and had a job within 4 weeks. He didn't pay cash either.
Nobody is going to pay alot if you don't have skills. A door greeter a WMT just has to have a pulse and a smile. With or without a min wage skilled people won't be making $7.00 an hour.
Yes, and the door greeter still has to keep that pulse going, you know, with food and whatnot.
Or do you believe the people should subsidize the hire of the greeter? If Walmart needs a greeter, then they should pay said greeter for the time the greeter stands on their premises greeting.
Yes, and the door greeter still has to keep that pulse going, you know, with food and whatnot.
Or do you believe the people should subsidize the hire of the greeter? If Walmart needs a greeter, then they should pay said greeter for the time the greeter stands on their premises greeting.
Last I checked slavery was illegal and WMT paid their door greeters hourly wages plus benefits. If the door greeter wants an Audi they need to improve their skills.
So? If you can't become a doctor you become something else. I know somebody that used to work in retail and he improved his lot in life. Now he wasn't making min wage, maybe $18 or so, but he wanted to make more so he took a CDL class and had a job within 4 weeks. He didn't pay cash either.
Nobody is going to pay alot if you don't have skills. A door greeter a WMT just has to have a pulse and a smile. With or without a min wage skilled people won't be making $7.00 an hour.
Some people can't afford to take classes, I can't.
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