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Many were innocent people. And many had mortgages that spelled out how far behind they could get before being foreclosed upon. But the mortgages were sold and transferred so many times, that the new lender didn't even have a copy of the mortgage, and applied their own rules to foreclosure, NOT the contract that was signed by the borrower. That's a bank error. And there are plenty of homeowners who weren't behind on their payments at all, because they were restructuring their debt, and the clock was supposed to stop ticking while the new terms of the loan were being negotiated. That's a bank error. And then there were the homeowners who weren't behind at all. And the foreclosures where the bank's foreclosed on the wrong address. Your insistence that these were not innocent people is not accurate. If it's the bank's error, then the bank is at fault. Which makes these people innocent victims. Especially, when the homeowners explained to bank officials that it was a bank error, and the bank ignored them. And the homeowners are additionally harmed by the ding to their credit, and by the real value of their homes that was lost. The cost of moving is not negligible. The cost to the neighborhood and the homeowners around them is not negligible. And the banks feel little to no repercussions for their mistakes. That's wrong.
Yes the notes were transferred so many times and sold over and over again when they securitized them that the banks (servicers) who were left to do the foreclosures didn't even have the note. The courts allowed them to file lost note claims and the like, or they robo signed the things which they were caught doing but just fined. Basically lying to the courts and nobody cared. The servicers also told them that they couldn't help them with Hamp or a refi unless they were first behind a couple months to begin with, another lie, then when folks did that they get the run around and never get their refi and fall so far behind they can't make it up. All kinds of lies and phone tag games these banks played with people who thought they were trying to help them. It's a shame. Sure some took advantage of it too but many more were sent packing by this whole fiasco and the ones who took the gamble and bought those risky securities were bailed out. Now they are starting it up all over again.
Excellent topic. Amusing the banks campaigned to have Americans blaming each other, (you will see such nonsense on real estate forum still)
If you look at S Florida, it speaks for itself. many excellent articles here:
[SIZE=3]Anthony G Woodward A LONG TIME - PROVEN -COURT ROOM LIAR filed some 40,000 perjured affidavits in foreclosure fraud cases over several years. [/SIZE][SIZE=2]Woodward helped ruin the lives of tens of thousands of Florida Home Owners by filing false affidavits in support of illegal and unearned legal fees, for The Florida Default Law Group. See Woodward's [/SIZE][SIZE=2]Bar Complaint[/SIZE][SIZE=2] and [/SIZE][SIZE=2]Judgment[/SIZE][SIZE=2]. This issue continues today without hope of it being immediately halted, because Florida Default was able to recruit Erin Collins Cullaro of the Attorney Generals office to do the same fraud that resulted in Anthony Woodward's suspension. [/SIZE]
Florida Government along with the Florida Association of Mortgage Brokers (FAMB) knew since 2004 massive fraud was being committed in the mortgage industry, yet did nothing to industry leaders like Anthony Woodward, Didier Malagies, Michael Echevarria, Morris Berch and others. Florida is now ranked worst in the nation.
Mortgage fraud and foreclosure mills.
Banking/housing must be regulated. Its not a partisan issue, its too important.
Foreclosure Fraud and The Florida Bar
Western Miami I saw a cadre of developments (overbuilt) and houses now stand empty or vandalized. It is a disgrace.
There were very legitimate reasons for protests and for people to be upset. I remember talking to a very wealthy man about things on a trip and and getting a breakdown on how we essentially got screwed during the bailout.
We save their businesses then they foreclose people on their homes and bonus themselves millions a piece with taxpayer money.
Stupid people borrowed money they knew they could not pay back. If you buy a home for $400,000 and the bank says you pay $500 a month for five years then $5000 a month years six through thirty, use your damn head for God's sake.
Except that if you were in one of the hot real estate markets then in six years you could be selling it for significantly more. As this chart shows in San Francisco you could have bought a 400k home in 2000 and sold it for over 800k in 2006.
Those were the types of numbers people and investors where looking at. It in part explains how subprime mortgages could get rated as triple A in the derivatives market. Way too many people, including many investment bankers assumed that the worst case was they would just have to foreclose on the property and resell it often for more than the original investment.
Yes, the lender should decide. And if the lender makes a mistake .. there should be no guarantor which will ask for a government bail-out or helping hand. Let the lendor/private guarantor suffer the loss. And if those mistakes collectively cause a devaluation of other properties ... then the property owners harmed should have recourse to collect damages from the lenders.
I don't have a problem with the concept in theory and practice in most cases. However if it isn't just a single individual or institution, but the vast majority of the financial institutions that will collapse resulting in bringing everyone else down with them then I don't think there are many rational alternatives but to step in and rescue the institutions.
I don't have a problem with the concept in theory and practice in most cases. However if it isn't just a single individual or institution, but the vast majority of the financial institutions that will collapse resulting in bringing everyone else down with them then I don't think there are many rational alternatives but to step in and rescue the institutions.
Then the solution is to break up the too big to fail so they no longer pose a danger to our country yes?
Also, these people should be nowhere near our government since they can't be trusted to serve the best interest of the nation, but only to serve themselves and their fellow cronies by writing policies to benefit them and screw everyone else.
The damage these cockroaches have done to this country far exceeds what the few terrorists attacks have done in a few small areas in the past few years.
The terrorists need to be rotting in hell and they applies to the financial terrorists as well.
People usually say they go into government to perform public service. If they came from Wall Street, however, their former employers often provide another service.
Banks, including JPMorgan Chase, Goldman Sachs and Morgan Stanley, all have provisions that allow acceleration of payments owed to senior executives if they take government jobs, a new study finds.
Such a benefit was highlighted recently during the confirmation hearing for Jacob J. Lew as Treasury secretary. His previous employer, Citigroup, had guaranteed him preferential financial treatment if he were to leave to take a job in the government. When Mr. Lew left Citigroup he held stock that he could not immediately cash worth as much as $500,000, according to a government filing.
"These companies seem to be giving a special deal to executives who become government officials," says the study, to be released Thursday by the Project on Government Oversight. "In exchange, the companies may end up with friends in high places who understand their business, sympathize with it, and can craft policies in its favor."
Location: Just transplanted to FL from the N GA mountains
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KUchief25
Yes the notes were transferred so many times and sold over and over again when they securitized them that the banks (servicers) who were left to do the foreclosures didn't even have the note. The courts allowed them to file lost note claims and the like, or they robo signed the things which they were caught doing but just fined. Basically lying to the courts and nobody cared. The servicers also told them that they couldn't help them with Hamp or a refi unless they were first behind a couple months to begin with, another lie, then when folks did that they get the run around and never get their refi and fall so far behind they can't make it up. All kinds of lies and phone tag games these banks played with people who thought they were trying to help them. It's a shame. Sure some took advantage of it too but many more were sent packing by this whole fiasco and the ones who took the gamble and bought those risky securities were bailed out. Now they are starting it up all over again.
I find it hard to believe that no one could "find" the notes... all anyone has to do is go to the courthouse of the county the property is located. All mortgages and notes have to be recorded so a copy of the original documents would be filed. That's how a title company can tell you everything about the property without having to go from bank to bank. Granted the original might have been setting in some bank, but "losing"... nope.. I agree that there were banks that took advantage... but... at the same time.. some of these folks had no business what so ever buying real estate. IMHO.
Then the solution is to break up the too big to fail so they no longer pose a danger to our country yes?
Also, these people should be nowhere near our government since they can't be trusted to serve the best interest of the nation, but only to serve themselves and their fellow cronies by writing policies to benefit them and screw everyone else.
The damage these cockroaches have done to this country far exceeds what the few terrorists attacks have done in a few small areas in the past few years.
The terrorists need to be rotting in hell and they applies to the financial terrorists as well.
What is the difference if its 9 out of 10 or 900 out of a 1000, particularly if the 9 or 900 failing institutions represent almost 100% of the financial assets. The problem wasn't just that a large institution messed up, the problem was a large majority of the financial institutions messed up together at the same time.
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