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Old 04-27-2014, 11:54 AM
 
24,832 posts, read 37,356,060 times
Reputation: 11539

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Quote:
Originally Posted by pollyrobin View Post
I do not believe that argument. I am talking about a Medicare for all with no copays -
that is why I attached my link.

There is no literature that demonstrates costs would go up with a single payer delivery system.
But there are many that prove they would go down.
Just simply look at the health care costs of any other nation that has universal health care systems.
We are alone on this. We are wrong. We should care enough about our country and our
citizens to be on the "right" side of this issue - single payer universal It is the patriotic thing to do
If the government is involved....the cost will skyrocket. (I just had to steal that phase from Obama)

 
Old 04-27-2014, 11:56 AM
 
Location: Østenfor sol og vestenfor måne
17,916 posts, read 24,369,707 times
Reputation: 39038
The doctor is an oathbreaker.
 
Old 04-27-2014, 11:57 AM
 
18,804 posts, read 8,479,367 times
Reputation: 4130
Quote:
Originally Posted by pollyrobin View Post
A patient can't sue a hospital for negligence of a non employee doctor.
Sure they can, we're involved with just such a case with one of our private group docs right now.

The doc(s) wanted to operate, the hospital insisted we couldn't handle the patient here, and the hospital insisted on transfer. The patient suffered serious complications as a result of that transfer, and all got sued.
 
Old 04-27-2014, 11:58 AM
 
Location: Where they serve real ale.
7,242 posts, read 7,910,626 times
Reputation: 3497
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoonose View Post
If we had single payer, overall costs would only go up. How much more 'up' than what we have now is hard to say.
That is completely contrary to the experiences of EVERY SINGLE other country in the world with single payer. All of them, and I do mean ALL of them, saw costs not only go down but go down dramatically.
 
Old 04-27-2014, 11:59 AM
 
24,832 posts, read 37,356,060 times
Reputation: 11539
Quote:
Originally Posted by ABQConvict View Post
The doctor is an oathbreaker.
How is he doing harm???

The client is stable...there is no emergency.
 
Old 04-27-2014, 11:59 AM
 
18,804 posts, read 8,479,367 times
Reputation: 4130
Quote:
Originally Posted by pollyrobin View Post
I do not believe that argument. I am talking about a Medicare for all with no copays -
that is why I attached my link.


You have to have means testing, copays and deductibles. Otherwise the amount of stuff that gets done on everyone goes right through the roof!

By the way I remain in favor of the public option.
 
Old 04-27-2014, 12:00 PM
 
69,368 posts, read 64,135,461 times
Reputation: 9383
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoonose View Post
Too many moral hazards on the for profit side.

Cherry picking of cases that are easier and cheaper to deal with, yet get full payment.

So the low payers, the no payers, the complicated, difficult and prolonged cases get shunted to another hospital.
I guess car dealerships shouldnt own repair shops then because clearly there would be motive to sell lemon cars and then charge consumers to repair vehicles..

yeah right..
 
Old 04-27-2014, 12:03 PM
 
18,804 posts, read 8,479,367 times
Reputation: 4130
Quote:
Originally Posted by Think4Yourself View Post
That is completely contrary to the experiences of EVERY SINGLE other country in the world with single payer. All of them, and I do mean ALL of them, saw costs not only go down but go down dramatically.
You have to understand 'we' are not 'every other country'. And our ultimate solution will have to be very American, which is not UHC. At least not yet.

The basis of our HC delivery has to still remain in the private sector.

Many countries that do have better cost containment than we are either smaller or more homogeneous cultures, or use very heavy handed central mandates and cost controls. And ALL of them are also experiencing significant cost increases, as it's inevitable everywhere.
 
Old 04-27-2014, 12:04 PM
 
18,804 posts, read 8,479,367 times
Reputation: 4130
Quote:
Originally Posted by pghquest View Post
I guess car dealerships shouldnt own repair shops then because clearly there would be motive to sell lemon cars and then charge consumers to repair vehicles..

yeah right..
You don't know that there is abuse in the warranty/car repair business?
 
Old 04-27-2014, 12:07 PM
 
69,368 posts, read 64,135,461 times
Reputation: 9383
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoonose View Post
You don't know that there is abuse in the warranty/car repair business?
Of course there is, are you suggesting we should nationalize car repair businesses now?
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