Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 12-31-2015, 09:33 AM
 
Location: Portland, Oregon
46,001 posts, read 35,180,801 times
Reputation: 7875

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by momonkey View Post
I believe the bakeries in question offer no special order wedding cakes for same-sex weddings to anyone, either heterosexual or homosexual.
There is nothing special about a same sex wedding cake, it is the same cake a straight couple would buy. You are on the losing end of this argument.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 12-31-2015, 09:50 AM
 
Location: Seymour, CT
3,639 posts, read 3,340,370 times
Reputation: 3089
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
It's a First Amendment Right, and one that specifically states that no law can be passed prohibiting that Right.

Which religion commands that? Seems you're confusing Bible verses with actual religious practices and prohibitions.

You'd be surprised at the variety of people helped by actually observing our First Amendment Right to exercise our religion freely:

http://thefederalist.com/2015/03/30/...like-indianas/
Under this perspective you would have to allow someone to kill another person due to a religious command. There are many religions out there, some with very barbaric commands and beliefs (Christians included). If you accept that a religious commandment can allow for discrimination, it is only a slippery slope from there.

So either religious freedom trumps everything, or it doesn't. If someone could not KILL in the name of religion, then obviously the free exercise clause is by its very definition NOT an end all be all. It does not trump everything.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-31-2015, 10:10 AM
 
13,303 posts, read 7,870,141 times
Reputation: 2144
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smash255 View Post
They offer wedding cakes period. The type of wedding doesn't matter.
It was an agenda cake, not a wedding cake.

I think "Agenda" will become a popular girl's name soon.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-31-2015, 10:27 AM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
50,822 posts, read 24,321,239 times
Reputation: 32953
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.Hospitality View Post
You don't carelessly leave yourself in such a vulnerable position. You call your roadside assistance service provider and tell them what happened. They'll make things right.
Not everyone has a roadside assistance service provider.

But you're missing the bigger point. You're sort of assuming everyone lives in a city where there are multiple "everythings". I'm from a small town where there was only 1 grocery store, 1 bakery, 1 dry cleaner, 1 bank, etc.

Yes, I've lived in large suburban areas where there are lots of choices.

But now I live in the west where there are major highways where you can easily drive 50-100 miles with only 1 gas station.

For many people in this country, there's not always multiple choices. And your feelings would be much different if your only local grocery store didn't serve Christians.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-31-2015, 10:29 AM
 
Location: Long Island
57,294 posts, read 26,206,502 times
Reputation: 15645
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
Muslim cashiers do not get to refuse to ring up pork products. Muslim women do not get to keep their hijab on when going through TSA security checkpoints.

Oops... Apparently Muslims have First Amendment Rights but Christians don't? Either First Amendment Rights for all or such Rights for none.
What Muslim cashier refused to ring up pork products
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-31-2015, 10:43 AM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,026 posts, read 44,840,107 times
Reputation: 13714
Quote:
Originally Posted by wolf39us View Post
Under this perspective you would have to allow someone to kill another person due to a religious command. There are many religions out there, some with very barbaric commands and beliefs (Christians included). If you accept that a religious commandment can allow for discrimination, it is only a slippery slope from there.
Nope. Read about the Santeria priest in the article I linked. He won his case.

The test widely recognized is if there's a less burdensome (to one's religious belief) way to achieve the same result. In the case of wedding goods/service providers, there is. Same sex couples can patronize other businesses providing the same wedding goods/services. Incidentally, that test is why Hobby Lobby won their Obamacare SCOTUS case. Women can access abortifacients via other means.

Same sex couples can buy wedding goids/services from other providers.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-31-2015, 10:44 AM
 
Location: Long Island
57,294 posts, read 26,206,502 times
Reputation: 15645
Quote:
Originally Posted by wolf39us View Post
Under this perspective you would have to allow someone to kill another person due to a religious command. There are many religions out there, some with very barbaric commands and beliefs (Christians included). If you accept that a religious commandment can allow for discrimination, it is only a slippery slope from there.

So either religious freedom trumps everything, or it doesn't. If someone could not KILL in the name of religion, then obviously the free exercise clause is by its very definition NOT an end all be all. It does not trump everything.


Those were examples of people praticing their religion seeking wavers of standards or laws, it was not an imposition on other people, none restricted the personal freedom of others.

The bakers actions impacted others.

Religion doesn't "trump everything".
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-31-2015, 10:49 AM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,026 posts, read 44,840,107 times
Reputation: 13714
Quote:
Originally Posted by Goodnight View Post

Those were examples of people praticing their religion seeking wavers of standards or laws, it was not an imposition on other people, none restricted the personal freedom of others.

The bakers actions impacted others.
So did Hobby Lobby's. Hobby Lobby won.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-31-2015, 10:52 AM
Status: "Apparently the worst poster on CD" (set 28 days ago)
 
27,647 posts, read 16,138,284 times
Reputation: 19074
someone should invent a new "butt cake" pan
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-31-2015, 11:16 AM
 
Location: Seymour, CT
3,639 posts, read 3,340,370 times
Reputation: 3089
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
Nope. Read about the Santeria priest in the article I linked. He won his case.

The test widely recognized is if there's a less burdensome (to one's religious belief) way to achieve the same result. In the case of wedding goods/service providers, there is. Same sex couples can patronize other businesses providing the same wedding goods/services. Incidentally, that test is why Hobby Lobby won their Obamacare SCOTUS case. Women can access abortifacients via other means.

Same sex couples can buy wedding goids/services from other providers.
Again, it's a slippery slope. What if every provider in 200 miles refuses because of religion? What do you do then?

The answer is simple. If you provide a service to the public, then you cannot discriminate based on sexual orientation, race, age etc. it would be the same logic that prevented black people from receiving services because of race. It is unacceptable and should remain that way.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies
Similar Threads

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 12:27 AM.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top