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Old 07-01-2016, 09:00 AM
 
Location: The South
7,480 posts, read 6,267,244 times
Reputation: 13002

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Quote:
Originally Posted by PCALMike View Post
Unable to answer I see. Why havent you thought about the consequences of the "government is evil" rhetoric? We need LAWS and who will write these laws in an environment of massive wealth and income inequality if not the donor class? Its like shooting yourself in the foot. If you are NOT ultra rich and you support policies that will sharply increase inequality because you think "markets are great, government is evil, rich people should be fawned over, taxes are theft" or some other far right talking point, then you are basically saying that the interests of you and your family dont matter.
20,642 New Regulations Added in the Obama Presidency
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Old 07-01-2016, 09:06 AM
 
Location: Tennessee
37,803 posts, read 41,036,241 times
Reputation: 62204
Quote:
Originally Posted by PCALMike View Post
But who will write the patent laws, trade deals, anti-trust legislation and so much more in an economy where the ultra rich have so much wealth and power?
Is this before or after we put all of the lawyer/politicians on the Titanic II?
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Old 07-01-2016, 09:08 AM
 
Location: louisville
4,754 posts, read 2,742,156 times
Reputation: 1721
Quote:
Originally Posted by PedroMartinez View Post
I'd argue that government quantitative easing benefits the rich on Wall Street while hurting the middle class and poor.
Not just Wall Street but state and local governments in addition to the large banks.

So QE floods made up money at below market interest rates to chase, boa, wells, etc... Int rates are accurate to reduce the money supply.

In turn, state, local, borrows via bonds for infrastructure (3 bridges over the Ohio here locally!) those firms hire, based off inflated capital, then get to control that infrastructure for 20 years (tolls).

Small business lending is eased via artificially low interest rates so a ton of restaurants and retail shops fill those empty strip malls. Tons of service 'help wanted' signs.

What's wrong with this picture? We created the absolute last bubble available and this one isn't based on any assets... It's based on credit.

But there's nothing to see... Unemployment is great!
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Old 07-01-2016, 09:10 AM
 
34,619 posts, read 21,635,782 times
Reputation: 22232
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stymie13 View Post
Not just Wall Street but state and local governments in addition to the large banks.

So QE floods made up money at below market interest rates to chase, boa, wells, etc... Int rates are accurate to reduce the money supply.

In turn, state, local, borrows via bonds for infrastructure (3 bridges over the Ohio here locally!) those firms hire, based off inflated capital, then get to control that infrastructure for 20 years (tolls).

Small business lending is eased via artificially low interest rates so a ton of restaurants and retail shops fill those empty strip malls. Tons of service 'help wanted' signs.

What's wrong with this picture? We created the absolute last bubble available and this one isn't based on any assets... It's based on credit.

But there's nothing to see... Unemployment is great!
Government creating an artificial bubble, how can that be bad? What could possibly go wrong?
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Old 07-01-2016, 09:41 AM
 
20,728 posts, read 19,377,191 times
Reputation: 8293
Quote:
Originally Posted by finalmove View Post
Anyone know what this rant is about?

Yes I do actually. People who never actually studied trade and free trade don't seem to notice Adam Smith and Ricardo were arguing for basic structural advantages. Coconuts for wool makes perfect sense. Adam Smith was arguing against mercantilism. Can't have free trade when every good is wrapped into some sort of regulated wrapper to support a monopoly, or when it is quite the opposite and the regulation on basic environmental and civil protections are stripped away to compete. Our fellow Americans cannot compete because they are not efficient enough to pollute the river and use child labor? He is pointing out currency manipulation, patent laws , pollution, slave labor, and command economy was not the basis of free trade in the classical era. How can one have free trade between countries that use coercion? When China uses prison labor do you not laugh out loud to have a free trade agreement with them?
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Old 07-01-2016, 09:43 AM
 
Location: louisville
4,754 posts, read 2,742,156 times
Reputation: 1721
Quote:
Originally Posted by PedroMartinez View Post
Government creating an artificial bubble, how can that be bad? What could possibly go wrong?
Just like these databases being created in secret. What could possibly go wrong there?
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Old 07-01-2016, 09:47 AM
 
33,387 posts, read 34,863,645 times
Reputation: 20030
Quote:
Originally Posted by PCALMike View Post
This is question to libertarians and market fundamentalists: We know that income and wealth inequality will skyrocket by design under these type of policies. This is embraced as "fair" and "great" because the market is just super great. But who will write the patent laws, trade deals, anti-trust legislation and so much more in an economy where the ultra rich have so much wealth and power? Your answer is that if we just shrink the government everything will be fine, but who will write the patent laws, trade deals and anti-trust legislation? The ultra wealthy would basically have full control over this process and will steamroll over 99.99% of the population. What is so great about that?
we have NEVER indicated that we want no government, but rather SMALL government that abides by the constitution. what is the purpose of the federal government? according to the constitution it is the body that deals with trade, interstate commerce, protection of the entire country, among other things, that means that patent law, anti-trust law, among other things ARE WITHIN the purview of the federal government.

try reading the constitution, it spells out what the federal government is allowed and not allowed to do.
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Old 07-01-2016, 09:52 AM
 
14,221 posts, read 6,969,746 times
Reputation: 6059
Quote:
Originally Posted by rbohm View Post
we have NEVER indicated that we want no government, but rather SMALL government that abides by the constitution. what is the purpose of the federal government? according to the constitution it is the body that deals with trade, interstate commerce, protection of the entire country, among other things, that means that patent law, anti-trust law, among other things ARE WITHIN the purview of the federal government.

try reading the constitution, it spells out what the federal government is allowed and not allowed to do.
But you dont answer the question. Who will write these patent laws and trade deals and anti-trust laws in a society where the rich control 99% of the wealth and 90% of the income? Remember wealth=power. It will be government by and for the plutocracy. This is called oligarchy and is terrible. Or do you like a system where 99.9% of the people are slaves of the super rich?
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Old 07-01-2016, 10:00 AM
 
Location: MS
4,395 posts, read 4,915,062 times
Reputation: 1564
Quote:
Originally Posted by PCALMike View Post
Your example is that the people should demand a law which increases consumer power. This goes directly against the fact that wealth=power. The more lopsided wealth and income becomes, the less democratic the system becomes.

I want policies that are proven to DECREASE income and wealth inequality and INCREASE power and opportunity for the people. Not go full steam ahead towards aristocracy. It can become IMPOSSIBLE to get rid of such an aristocracy if they gain enough wealth and power.
I want government out of day to day business and let the chips fall where they may.
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Old 07-01-2016, 10:02 AM
 
Location: MS
4,395 posts, read 4,915,062 times
Reputation: 1564
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stymie13 View Post
The closest I can assign is an 'originalist'.

This election cycle is moving me towards an anarchist! Lol

It truly seems many can only think incrementally these days, and incrementalism is what has led to gov creep.

I don't hate the government. It's not evil. It's extremely inefficient as currently set up.

Besides the irs, I'd like to:

1. A pres candidate cannot declare until December 31 before the election year. 10 primaries a month for 5 months. This eliminates almost 16 months of election cycle bs
2. Repeal the 17th amendment. This eliminates money into senators pocket
3. Term limit the house to 3 consecutive terms (6 years in a row is enough)
4. Cap Supreme Court appointments to 20 years
5. Eliminate the lifetime benefit of congress
6. Repeal the war powers act
7. Pass an amendment that any force must require a declaration of war (that is a compromise because I understand the need for some flexibility but it's been so over used I'd like them to start back from scratch)
8. Petition to sunset nato
9. Abolish the TSA
10. Abolish homeland security
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