Transgender Boy Kicked Out Of Boy Scouts; People Mad Again (Brown, private school)
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You are confusing biological sex with societal gender norms.
Wasn't my question, but ok....
What determines sex then? Because it's not body parts.
This does create some complexities too. Are the Boy Scouts concerned with males (sex) or boys (gender)? I don't really care which, but depending on what it is, that can determine who they can and can't turn away, according to their own policy. If it's males, they have no choice but to accept anyone born a man, even if they identity as female. And if it's boys, shouldn't be have to accept a person identifying as a girl who was born a boy? Or do you have to be both male and a boy? The thing is, can someone who says they're a boy and a male show up in a dress and still be welcomes?
Or, the more likely truth, the Boy Scouts doesn't want to hear about sex vs gender debate so bringing the difference up to them simply won't matter.
Boy Scouts are a private organization. They get to choose who they allow in their group.
Should we be outraged that the Girl Scouts don't let men join?
True. The BSA, as a private org., has the legal right to determine its membership policies. "Freedom of association."
This is very different from, say, that bakery that wouldn't sell a cake to a gay couple. In that case, it was a for profit business serving the general public. Therefore, it had no legal right to violate federal discrimination laws and refuse to sell to select members of the public. In the old days, it would have meant a "No Jews or blacks" sign in the window of the bakery.
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Location: Pine Grove,AL
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skepticratic
Wasn't my question, but ok....
What determines sex then? Because it's not body parts.
This does create some complexities too. Are the Boy Scouts concerned with males (sex) or boys (gender)? I don't really care which, but depending on what it is, that can determine who they can and can't turn away, according to their own policy. If it's males, they have no choice but to accept anyone born a man, even if they identity as female. And if it's boys, shouldn't be have to accept a person identifying as a girl who was born a boy? Or do you have to be both male and a boy? The thing is, can someone who says they're a boy and a male show up in a dress and still be welcomes?
Or, the more likely truth, the Boy Scouts doesn't want to hear about sex vs gender debate so bringing the difference up to them simply won't matter.
Sex (male female)= body part
gender(boy girl) = social construct.
In short, someone can be male and be a girl, or female and be a boy.
arguing the difference with anyone regardless of what side they stand is hard. I have made the case myself that if you truly believe gender and sex are different(separate), then your sexual organ shouldnt be a factor(AKA, cutting off your breast or penis doesnt make sense unless you are just trying to conform to society).
same thing with bathrooms, they are designed for body parts more so than genders. If you go into a mens room, you may have 1 or 2 toilets and 4 of 5 urinals, vs 8 toilets in the women's.
People need to come to grips with the fact that not everything is for them. Society has tried to be accommodating but there are limits to what any of us can expect. Sometimes our lives and our choices come with restrictions, and we need to respect that because the world isn't JUST FOR US.
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"everybody getting reported now.."
(set 26 days ago)
Location: Pine Grove,AL
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ceece
People need to come to grips with the fact that not everything is for them. Society has tried to be accommodating but there are limits to what any of us can expect. Sometimes our lives and our choices come with restrictions, and we need to respect that because the world isn't JUST FOR US.
But you put forth nothing to support that argument. Who does it hurt to allow this boy to join the scouts( he was apparently already a member)
Did anyone catch that a troop in the UK has reached out to the boy involved to offer him membership. The UK, people, where Boy Scouting originated under the leadership of Lord Baden Powell.
The Council's line is that BSA's commitment to non-discrimination against gay scouts & leaders does not apply to issues of gender identification, which is ridiculous given that BSA has offered membership to teenage girls through its Explorer program since 1969. Today, BSA offers membership to young women aged 14-21 through its Exploring, Venturing, and Sea Scouting programs. These young women routinely work and camp with young men and serve as youth leaders in summer camps across the nation. Sleeping and bathing accommodations are already in place for the separate genders, so there's really no legitimate excuse to deny a transgender young person a place in the organization. If the teenagers can camp together successfully, I see no reason to deny a transgender eight-year-old a place in a Cub Scout pack where a parent or guardian must accompany every boy on an overnight trip.
I'm asking again becasue this doesn't justify your point. Murders, rapists, and child molesters (making a distinction from pedophile as it's rare we notice someone is a pedophile before they actually do something dangerous) represent a threat to others. A trans person does not. Just because you don't want your kid to be exposed to it doesn't mean anything. Be a less ****ty parent. Just because a trans person may cause your kid to ask you a difficult question doesn't mean you can takeaway someone's freedom.
FTR, I'm an awesome parent. I'll ask you why the rest of us should be expected to go along with the pretense that a man can become a woman or vice versa? I don't want my child taught that this is possible, that the notion is in any way acceptable, or that these mentally ill creatures are safe to be around. And yes, I have already had that talk with my child. I would not want her taught differently in a classroom where the teacher or school board feels differently. Society is not served by going along with such a garbage idea that this is ok.
FTR, I'm an awesome parent. I'll ask you why the rest of us should be expected to go along with the pretense that a man can become a woman or vice versa? I don't want my child taught that this is possible, that the notion is in any way acceptable, or that these mentally ill creatures are safe to be around. And yes, I have already had that talk with my child. I would not want her taught differently in a classroom where the teacher or school board feels differently. Society is not served by going along with such a garbage idea that this is ok.
Parochial schools are the answer. Where boys are boys and girls are girls and the gender confused are invited to comply or go somewhere else.
Last edited by suzy_q2010; 12-28-2016 at 05:41 PM..
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