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What happened was they started with pushing healthcare forward for the first time in decades - in the process 20 million additional Americans were insured and rates stabilized. Infant mortality went down and many other indicators improved.
They didn't "do whatever they wanted". As you will know they have to compromise incredibly to even get it through.
Protestations? Another lie. If you keep repeating it you believe it. I followed the ACA polls since day one and it went something like this.
35% in favor
35% against
30% WANTED SOMETHING BETTER - closer to universal coverage.....
So, add together the 30 and 35% and you see that most Americans wanted Obamacare or better.
Of course, I don't expect most Republicans to understand a complex subject like that. Even Trump admitted it was too complicated for his little head.
As to Republicans, we know exactly what they want.
1. Let 'em die
2. Charge 'em more and drop more people from having coverage.
At least that is clear!
I followed it closely and was very involved in protesting too.
You are pulling these numbers out of fantasyland.
Sure there was compromise and a lot of backroom arm twisting as well as veiled bribes and pressure on certain members of Congress.
Health insurance is not healthcare and if you still can't pay the bills it is not very helpful either.
"Let 'em die" is just your mantra and you would not care for "Dems want to take everything you've worked hard for in the same vein.
We were there and witnessed what went on and what Americans were saying and it was not what you relate.
BTW, China spends $800 per person per year on health care.
You can see a specialist the same day - get an MRI and then go back the specialist.
We spend 15X as much......per person...for MUCH worse care. The reason is PROFITS to the corporation. We have predatory capitalistic health care...which simply does not work. The Hospital makes more if they make you sicker!
Life span in China is 3 years less - but they are catching up quickly.
Our system is a national embarrassment. Just as are many of our other expenditures such as a TRILLION plus on "security" while we could easily cut 30% and be just as "safe".
It's all about the profits, folks. Old Rudy Guliani - son of a criminal - is now making 100's of millions in "security consulting"....
No. The only opposition is coming from Red State Democrats (who got voted out anyway, ironically), and neo-Confederates in the GOP (overwhelming majority of the GOP)
No, I think he is right - or he was at least certainly right 8 years ago.
Democrats could have created a national system and came up with this crappy Obamacare system.
With that said, if the Republicans weren't short sighted, they would realize that the younger generation wants a national system and that it will happen sooner or later. They should take the initiative and pass it now and get something big in exchange for it.
What makes the US different, that would make such system a disaster?
Perhaps, because it's debatable whether it works or not.
Quote:
Significant differences in waiting times (p < 0.00001) were found among the systems for all four scenarios (elective and urgent angiography, elective and urgent bypass surgery). Compared with non-VA hospitals in the United States, waiting times were significantly longer in all systems, with the exception of waiting times for urgent surgery in the U.S. VA hospitals (p = 0.9). The longest waiting times for all four procedures were reported in the United Kingdom, Sweden and Canada, with some waiting times for elective procedures > 9 months.
If you need orthopedic care in Great Britain the goal is to get you to the spevialist by 18 weeks. Are you willing to wait 9 months for the bypass your doctor recommends because your arteries are blocked enough that you at high risk for a heart attack, but it is considered an elective because you haven't had that heart attack yet? Or 18 weeks to get your plantar fasciitis treatment or torn ACL surgery?
Americans don't understand the concept of wait lists, the citizens of England and Canada do.
Quote:
Surgery and specialists: Delaying hip replacement is associated with adverse outcomes and severe pain. In 2010, Canada’s median wait for hip replacement was 20.4 weeks. Despite government’s “guarantee” of timely treatment, 60% of Swedes wait more than three months. In England, the median wait after referral for hip replacement in 2011 was 91 days. In contrast, nearly 90% of American patients (almost half are under 65) received hip replacement in less than three weeks; no patients waited six months or more.
The US was among only three countries (with Germany and Switzerland) where less than 10% of patients waited more than two months for a specialist. Three to four times more patients waited longer than two months in Canada (41%), Norway (34%), Sweden (31%), and France (28%). In 2010, 60% of England’s NHS patients deemed ill enough by the GP waited more than two additional weeks and 31% more than one month for a specialist.
It isn't working and wealthier citizens in these countries are forgoing the free care for better care.
Quote:
Half a million Swedes now use private insurance, up from 100,000 a decade ago. Almost two-thirds of Brits earning more than $78,700 have done the same. But what might really surprise those who assert the excellence of nationalized insurance systems is that throughout Europe, from Britain to Denmark to Sweden, when faced with their inability to deliver timely access, the government’s solution is increasingly to enable access to private health care.
You can't have world class care for free.
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You die waiting in line for treatment in the countries you named. Why should a wealthy, responsible person who saved money for to protect themselves have to wait in line behind a poor person who didn't.
Dems had the chance in '09, what happened?
They did whatever they wanted to anyway above the protestations of most Americans.
Thats simple.. Dems worked with Pubs and gave up single payer and adopted 160 od GOP amendments.. then voila.. No GOP voted for it. So many Republicans believe Dems made the ADA law ( wrote it behind closed closed doors ala Ryan's latest stunt).. hide it from every body and GOP Congress.. Sometimes when one side is willing to compromise and give up something ..but when votes get counted.. None of those GOP amendments were agreed to by their caucus.
BTW much of those amendments were NOT what Libs wanted.. and in fact it's GOP amendments are causing the issues with ACA now..along with Red State sabotaging Medicare expansions.. refusing to have State sites for ACA signups. One doesn't wonder why those states failed in implementing the law and proper access. For 7 years ..GOP rhetoric demonized it.. and even with poor rollout .. 24 Million got HC ..some with subsidies and others who got HC coverages that actually covered things no one but the rich could afford prior.
I do recall having many discussions during 2009/2010 discussions, prior to passage of bill, with completely inaccurate beliefs of what it all meant.. I tried to explain it.. but mostly fell on deaf ears by the very ones today who have no appreciation of the benefits of ACA.
Prior to ACA.. No one with pre-existing conditions could get coverage unless filthy rich.. then there was "Lifetime limits" of claims.. Then of course there were those that bought the cheapest policy and found out afters years of premiums.. that their policy didn't cover a thing until they paid that deductible.
Insurance companies handed out Policies that gained premiums.. but never paid out 1 thin dime.. made a HUUGE profit.. Once ACA kicked in and Insurance couldn't bilk consumers like they had.. or out price policies beyond affordability .. voila.. Insurance were forced to abide by the rules.. and RED States reps demonized.. ALA.. HOW dare Dems make huge donors have to lessen their profits.. Capitalism SMH
Sorry.. but it's about time USA caught up with the rest of the Free World. It's not Socialism nor Communism nor anything else.. It's called.. STOP making citizens pay for a product that makes PROFITS for Corporations as that product really is a necessary evil in this day and age! Public services and donated HC workers who give of themselves free to help isn't enough to help the sick.
Anyone who is truly religious and follows the teachings cannot deny what was taught in the New Testament !! What GOP is preaching is basically aberrant to what is written in scriptures. Double standard/Hypocracy++++ ..
You die waiting in line for treatment in the countries you named. Why should a wealthy, responsible person who saved money for to protect themselves have to wait in line behind a poor person who didn't.
Did people from the UK and Canada tell you that?
The research by multiple organization originating in multiple countries does.
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When I post in bold red that is moderator action and, per the TOS, can only be discussed through Direct Message.
BTW, China spends $800 per person per year on health care.
You can see a specialist the same day - get an MRI and then go back the specialist.
We spend 15X as much......per person...for MUCH worse care. The reason is PROFITS to the corporation. We have predatory capitalistic health care...which simply does not work. The Hospital makes more if they make you sicker!
Whoa, let's have an honest discussion here.
#1 China's system isn't better than ours. The WHO ranks China's system 144th and ours 37th. Canada is 30.
#2 We don't have a true capitalistic system. 31% of counties in the US basically have a monopoly of just one option and the system is set up to stamp out competition so they can rack up the costs for medicine, etc...
What makes the US different, that would make such system a disaster?
You need to ask the Canadians that come to the US to see a doctor.
When I went to a doctor for a cataract job, he said lets do it Thursday. My snowbird neighbor went to her Ontario doctor also for a cataract job, he said "I will put you on the list, your turn will come up in about a year".
"Let 'em die" is just your mantra and you would not care for "Dems want to take everything you've worked hard for in the same vein.
We were there and witnessed what went on and what Americans were saying and it was not what you relate.
Let 'em Die is what was called out by HUNDREDS of the top Republicans (mostly Heritage Foundation Members, but also others) at the GOP POTUS debate in answer to a specific query.
Let's not confuse history now.
As to my figures - I can find them for you. I am fairly certain that a majority wanted the ACA or something better....Republicans have always mistaken that for "they don't want it", which is a major blunder as we have just seen.
Also, given the amount of money and BS spent by the opposition to prove Obama was the anti-Christ, it's amazing that even 10% would approve of Obamacare. Since many people are "taken care of" by the military, their employer or another entity it is also not really relevant to ask all Americans what they think of it. After all, why should the tri-care patient who gets care for him and his family for LIFE have an opinion about whether a small business should be able to pool and get insured? Think about it!
Lets talk about NOW. I know "conservatives" like to live in the past, but history only moves one way.
Today:
"The survey also finds that the words to describe such a [health care reform] plan clearly affect how people view it. For instance, nearly two-thirds (64%) of Americans say they have a positive reaction to the term “Medicare-for-all,” and most (57%) say the same about “guaranteed universal health coverage.”
Isn't it interesting that those number line up with what I said about the numbers back in 2010? It always depends on how you ask the question.
Bottom line - is that Americans don't want the GOP "lack of" health care plans. There is no polling which shows this - the plan they just put out gets 24% which ACA gets 58%.
So, are you ready to do what the American people want? Or is some ridiculous political slogan from 7 years back in a situation where you lost more important? These are big decisions and using your hurt feelings to solve them won't go far.
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