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Old 07-11-2017, 08:57 AM
 
33,016 posts, read 27,458,643 times
Reputation: 9074

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Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
Not everyone pays their fair share. In fact the bottom 95% pays LESS than their fair share, while the top 5% WAY overpays their fair share.

Top 1%:

Share of income: 20.58%
Share of federal income tax paid: 39.48%

Top 5%:

Share of income: 35.96%
Share of federal income tax paid: 59.97%

Top 5-10%:

Share of income: 11.25%
Share of federal income tax paid: 10.91%

Top 10-25%:

Share of income: 21.70%
Share of federal income tax paid: 15.90%

And the discrepancy of not paying a fair share widens even further from there.

Tables 5 and 6, here:
https://taxfoundation.org/summary-la...a-2016-update/

Data Source: IRS:
https://www.irs.gov/uac/soi-tax-stat...040-statistics

Who sets compensation for government workers? Not the poor. So why should private sector workers pay inflated taxes in order to give government workers fat compensation packages for doing similar work?

e.g. I once worked as a janitor, working alongside government janitors who were paid 3x my nominal wage plus 2x more in benefits. Why shouldn't they pay more taxes?
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Old 07-11-2017, 08:57 AM
 
5,051 posts, read 3,579,807 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by freemkt View Post
A flat rate (percentaqe) of all consumption above 20% of median consumption per Consumer Expenditure Survey (CES).
Consumption taxes are regressive and don't work to tax the rich their "share". The poor pay, the rich don't.

What's to stop millionaires from buying their Yacht in Monaco or keeping 50% or putting their Caribbean condo in the name of their Intl LLC - registered in Panama ?
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Old 07-11-2017, 09:12 AM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,006 posts, read 44,824,472 times
Reputation: 13709
Quote:
Originally Posted by freemkt View Post
Who sets compensation for government workers? Not the poor. So why should private sector workers pay inflated taxes in order to give government workers fat compensation packages for doing similar work?
That has absolutely nothing to do with the fact that the top 5% WAY over-pays their fair share while the bottom 95% underpays their fair share.
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Old 07-11-2017, 09:23 AM
 
33,016 posts, read 27,458,643 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
That has absolutely nothing to do with the fact that the top 5% WAY over-pays their fair share while the bottom 95% underpays their fair share.

I'm guessing that I paid a higher effective tax rate than the government janitors paid. They had mortgages and kids and those generous untaxed fringe benefits while I was a childless rent serf with no freebies or tax breaks.
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Old 07-11-2017, 09:36 AM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,006 posts, read 44,824,472 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by freemkt View Post
I'm guessing that I paid a higher effective tax rate than the government janitors paid.
The bottom line is you BOTH underpaid your fair share.

In order to pay one's fair share, nothing more and nothing less, one's effective federal income tax rate needs to be about 14%. That's total federal income tax revenue divided by total income.

$1.374 trillion ÷ $9.709 trillion = ~14%


Interesting chart that shows who's underpaying and who's overpaying their fair share:

Quote:
Summary of the Latest Federal Income Tax Data
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Old 07-11-2017, 09:39 AM
 
995 posts, read 1,695,426 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by freemkt View Post
Who sets compensation for government workers? Not the poor. So why should private sector workers pay inflated taxes in order to give government workers fat compensation packages for doing similar work?

e.g. I once worked as a janitor, working alongside government janitors who were paid 3x my nominal wage plus 2x more in benefits. Why shouldn't they pay more taxes?

If they were paid 3x your wage, they did pay more taxes.
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Old 07-11-2017, 09:51 AM
 
33,016 posts, read 27,458,643 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by idr591 View Post
If they were paid 3x your wage, they did pay more taxes.

Sure, and they paid a lower effective tax rate than I paid. I could argue that since I worked with them and did similar work, our employer underpaid me in order to overpay them, i.e. money was redistributed from my paycheck to theirs. You can't say with a straight face that their labor was worth 5x or even 3x my labor.
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Old 07-11-2017, 10:11 AM
 
19,632 posts, read 12,226,539 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PullMyFinger View Post
Wow, a lot of generalizations there. Don't hate people who are more successful than you. That is the number 1 thing I taught my children and anyone asking for advice. Learn from them.

Number one, they are SMART.

Number two, they are HARD WORKERS

Number three, they are WISE BEYOND THEIR YEARS. Most rich people I know started out making good decisions very early in life.

Even if they are people who inherited their money...if they invest it wisely they are still helping the economy and other people who depend on those funds for a living.
Those are generalizations as well. You also left out the concept of ethics.

Most people who make it have to step on toes. It is just the reality. Take being a lawyer, it is not possible to be totally straight forward and also bill the highest amount of hours. Some will do honest work, but most want to drag a case out for more hours and that is not in the best interests of their clients. Financial advisors oversell all the time. Slumlords tend to get rich over decent landlords who care about their tenants.

This isn't hating on, it is simply the truth. Some of us reach a crossroads and if you don't take the morally lower road, you don't get to move very far ahead.
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Old 07-11-2017, 11:02 AM
 
26,694 posts, read 14,565,372 times
Reputation: 8094
Quote:
Originally Posted by tamajane View Post
Those are generalizations as well. You also left out the concept of ethics.

Most people who make it have to step on toes. It is just the reality. Take being a lawyer, it is not possible to be totally straight forward and also bill the highest amount of hours. Some will do honest work, but most want to drag a case out for more hours and that is not in the best interests of their clients. Financial advisors oversell all the time. Slumlords tend to get rich over decent landlords who care about their tenants.

This isn't hating on, it is simply the truth. Some of us reach a crossroads and if you don't take the morally lower road, you don't get to move very far ahead.
Only true if there aren't any competitors. I don't deny there are already going to be shady characters, but no company can really survive for being shady.

If company X can do it in shorter time, you wouldn't waste your time with company Y. Competition is forcing everybody to do things better and faster.
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Old 07-11-2017, 11:12 AM
 
14,611 posts, read 17,562,480 times
Reputation: 7783
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marleinie View Post
I am sure many are sick and tired of all these million/billionaires hogging all the money spending it on frivolous things rather than helping poor people. Hypothetically let's say every person that has millions/billions were forced to distribute all their money to the poor and social programs, how would you feel?

Wealth redistribution usually is not very effective. It's been tried many times, and often the country simply ends up being poorer. The money and talent simply ends up fleeing the country.
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