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1. More debt and deficit
2. Higher health care prices
3. Higher energy prices
4. Higher housing prices
5. More Security State funding
6. Higher interest rates
and so on........
Yet they work against many of us - I would say MOST of us.
At least make some sense. Even you cannot claim the DOW...the index you pointed out in the OP, is doing "great". It's not. We may have a lost year. Why the heck would we have zero in a year when trillions more had been borrowed and given out for free?
Sorry, but higher interest rates and health care costs don't make me happy. A higher DOW would.
GDP is disproportionately driven by consumer spending, thats not exactly a POTUS driven activity in most scenarios. Although one could argue that Obama "forced" people to buy guns and ammo, as well as new cars due to the cash for clunkers program, but I'm sure that those two items combined are not really noticeable in the overall GDP. So hardly much to do with any POTUS, Trump or Obama.
With health care being 20% of our economy and the Fed. Government budget being 20% it's hard to imagine. Add in local, state and county government and education and you have a majority of the GDP.
Add in the very basics - some of which are partially consumer spending, but not really.....
Food
Energy
Interest Rates
And you're most of the way there.
This is why GDP is indicative of nothing in a indebted and fully advanced society like ours. Tariffs add to GDP....great! If I get sick I add to GDP.
And, yes, this is something that has been clear for many decades. RFL gave a famous speech about it. You can google it and find it on Youtube. It's quite striking because here we are 60 years later and it seems many just don't get it.
If I can buy rice for $2 a pound GDP may be low, but at $5 a pound it is higher. Is that a good thing?
GDP is a good indicators during the growing years - the industrialization of a country - if used to compare it to other countries. That's about it.
The current model, IMHO, is often negative. I'm sure GDP went up when people were buying houses at 3X the price they were worth, right?
Only if we tied GDP to real wage growth of the masses would it mean anything. For example, if wages rose 5% this year and inflation was 2% and GDP was 3.5% and debt and deficit (both personal, corporate and government) was the same...then we could say a small gain was eeked out. Maybe.
With health care being 20% of our economy and the Fed. Government budget being 20% it's hard to imagine. Add in local, state and county government and education and you have a majority of the GDP.
Add in the very basics - some of which are partially consumer spending, but not really.....
Food
Energy
Interest Rates
And you're most of the way there.
This is why GDP is indicative of nothing in a indebted and fully advanced society like ours. Tariffs add to GDP....great! If I get sick I add to GDP.
And, yes, this is something that has been clear for many decades. RFL gave a famous speech about it. You can google it and find it on Youtube. It's quite striking because here we are 60 years later and it seems many just don't get it.
If I can buy rice for $2 a pound GDP may be low, but at $5 a pound it is higher. Is that a good thing?
GDP is a good indicators during the growing years - the industrialization of a country - if used to compare it to other countries. That's about it.
The current model, IMHO, is often negative. I'm sure GDP went up when people were buying houses at 3X the price they were worth, right?
Only if we tied GDP to real wage growth of the masses would it mean anything. For example, if wages rose 5% this year and inflation was 2% and GDP was 3.5% and debt and deficit (both personal, corporate and government) was the same...then we could say a small gain was eeked out. Maybe.
I've always been in the camp that higher GDP isn't always good, and that our government considering higher spending and lower savings as a measure of success is irresponsible, so I think we are in agreement here.
I mean the best way to protect the every day people from hard economic times is to ensure they aren't overspending, but instead are saving extra cash to get through hard times. However by pushing consumption with every lever they have, and simultaneously keeping interest rates low, its doubling down on the incentive for people to spend rather than save.
Last edited by t206; 10-29-2018 at 09:43 AM..
Reason: Level instead of level
With health care being 20% of our economy and the Fed. Government budget being 20% it's hard to imagine. Add in local, state and county government and education and you have a majority of the GDP.
Add in the very basics - some of which are partially consumer spending, but not really.....
Food
Energy
Interest Rates
And you're most of the way there.
This is why GDP is indicative of nothing in a indebted and fully advanced society like ours. Tariffs add to GDP....great! If I get sick I add to GDP.
And, yes, this is something that has been clear for many decades. RFL gave a famous speech about it. You can google it and find it on Youtube. It's quite striking because here we are 60 years later and it seems many just don't get it.
If I can buy rice for $2 a pound GDP may be low, but at $5 a pound it is higher. Is that a good thing?
GDP is a good indicators during the growing years - the industrialization of a country - if used to compare it to other countries. That's about it.
The current model, IMHO, is often negative. I'm sure GDP went up when people were buying houses at 3X the price they were worth, right?
Only if we tied GDP to real wage growth of the masses would it mean anything. For example, if wages rose 5% this year and inflation was 2% and GDP was 3.5% and debt and deficit (both personal, corporate and government) was the same...then we could say a small gain was eeked out. Maybe.
problem is trumpeters need something to cheer about, a "win" for their "team" so this is what they take. Most can't even explain it, but ape #Winning and cheer for their team like the used to do with the NFL before Daddy told them it was bad.
problem is trumpeters need something to cheer about, a "win" for their "team" so this is what they take. Most can't even explain it, but ape #Winning and cheer for their team like the used to do with the NFL before Daddy told them it was bad.
The right choses cheer and the left choses fear.
Investors chose to make money. Buy low sell high.
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