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The vaccine is 95% effective after one dose, 97% effective after two doses. 54 to 55 people would be alive if they'd had the vaccine.
And will you please learn to format correctly? I had to correct both of these quotes myself.
You cannot say that. They could all be dead. They could all be alive. Cannot make predictions about life.
Aside from the fact that some of the dead were not old enough to be vaccinated. Kinda skews the data when you are screaming about unvaxxed deaths when they weren't eligible for the shot in the first place. Maybe yell at the manufacturer about that pesky fact.
With an adequate immune system, guess what? You don't get sick.
Why aren't you yelling about car accidents? Cigarette smoking? High fructose corn syrup (diabetes)? Those are all deadly and kill hundreds of thousands. If death is why you are so adamant about vaccines, perhaps you should take on other areas where death is rampant. But no. Becuase vaccines. Because worship at the alter of big pharma.
Your immune system working is what makes you feel sick when you get an infection. Sore throat, fever, fatigue - all that is due to your immune system.
The immune system can even go overboard and cause a condition called cytokine storm.
It seems to me that there is plenty being done to reduce fatalities from car accidents, get people to stop smoking, and encourage lifestyle changes for prevention of diabetes. However, vaccines have prevented millions of deadly infections. That is worthwhile, too.
Quote:
Originally Posted by newtovenice
Why are politicians directing care? Because vaccines are not NOT healthcare. They are politics. That's why the govt intervened and protected the industry from liability.
Industry is not protected from defective products. It is protected from being sued for adverse reactions that are due to problems inherent in the person getting the vaccine. If 1 person in a million has an adverse reaction and the other 999,999 do not, the vaccine is not defective. Instead we have a system that provides awards to people who have adverse reactions to vaccines without their having to prove fault.
Quote:
Originally Posted by newtovenice
I can tell you have never read Wakefield's original reports.
Go to the original study of 13 patients. Find in the study where Wakefield says vaccines cause autism.
Should be VERY easy to find, right? Super easy. Find it the article. Link to it. Copy/past the text where he says vaccines cause autism.
"Background
We investigated a consecutive series of children with chronic enterocolitis and regressive developmental disorder."
"Behavioural disorders included autism (nine), disintegrative psychosis (one), and possible postviral or vaccinal encephalitis (two)."
"We have identified a chronic enterocolitis in children that may be related to neuropsychiatric dysfunction. In most cases, onset of symptoms was after measles, mumps, and rubella immunisation. Further investigations are needed to examine this syndrome and its possible relation to this vaccine."
Quote:
Originally Posted by newtovenice
She said all that ALL deaths could have been prevented. Which means, no one would have died had they gotten vaccinated. So no, not putting anything anywhere that it doesn't belong. Maybe talk to her about that directly, since she isn't clear that vaccines are not 100% effective.
Case of Mars bars to you if you can figure out WHY that statement is wrong om 2 accounts.
#1. Vaccines are not 100% effective
#2. ?? I know the answer. Do you? She apparently doesn't either. (hint: has to do with age of those who died)
And, it's 57 deaths out of total population. Since everyone is at risk since ... AGAIN ...vaccines are not 100% effective.
No one would have died if they had not gotten measles.
Vaccines are not 100% effective but the measles vaccine is close: 97%. Measles has been completely eliminated from the entire Western Hemisphere. The only way it gets to the US is by importation from a region where the virus still circulates in the wild. If those regions sustained a high enough vaccination rate, measles could be eliminated there, too, with potential for eradication of the virus completely, worldwide, as was done with smallpox. Therefore, deaths from measles are 100% preventable with effective vaccination programs, because such programs eliminate circulating measles. No measles, no deaths.
Since the vaccine is highly effective, the risk of catching measles is much higher if you are unvaccinated. That includes infants too young to be vaccinated, since it is not given until age 12 to 15 months. However, when the entire population is highly vaccinated those infants are protected by herd immunity.
The most recent death from measles in the US was an adult, by the way, a woman who was immunocompromised and got measles even though she had been vaccinated. Her immune deficiency wiped out her protection against measles.
No, everyone is not at risk. The people who are old enough to have had measles before the vaccine was released are immune and not at risk. Of those who are vaccinated, 97% are not at risk. Those at risk are those who are not vaccinated or immune by virtue of having had the disease plus the 3% who are not protected by the vaccine.
You cannot say that. They could all be dead. They could all be alive. Cannot make predictions about life.
Aside from the fact that some of the dead were not old enough to be vaccinated. Kinda skews the data when you are screaming about unvaxxed deaths when they weren't eligible for the shot in the first place. Maybe yell at the manufacturer about that pesky fact.
Since 97% of those who are vaccinated will not get measles, we can predict that they will not die from measles. The other 3% will predictably have milder disease and are also unlikely to die.
It does not matter whether you are unvaccinated for a medical reason or by choice. The problem is that those who choose not to vaccinate can rob the child who is too young to get the vaccine of the opportunity for his parents to choose to vaccinate him at the appropriate time.
I noticed the difference in HepB vaccine policy/procedure so I looked a little further & found that HepB immunization uptake in the 0-12-month-old population is at 55% in Canada, vs the uptake for the same population in the US at 93%. https://www.indexmundi.com/facts/indicators/SH.IMM.HEPB
This is, of course; The Greatest Fear of US public health officials: That any tolerance of a more baby-friendly immunization schedule would lead to plummeting rates of vaccine uptake, which would then cause Mass Outbreak, Disease & Death. Actually, this is not just The Greatest Fear; this is a known fact, we are told, due to our diligence in Science-Based Medicine.
This is why doctors in a state that has eliminated personal exemptions for vaccines, are being disciplined for granting medical exemptions. This why we are told that baby-friendly immunization schedules should be avoided: "It's not science-based medicine".
I can only assume that Canadian public health officials have informed the Canadian public that their HepB vaccine policy/procedure is also Science-Based Medicine? The difference between Canadian uptake & US uptake is an 38% discrepancy, which is large enough to be very statistically significant:
I noticed the difference in HepB vaccine policy/procedure so I looked a little further & found that HepB immunization uptake in the 0-12-month-old population is at 55% in Canada, vs the uptake for the same population in the US at 93%. https://www.indexmundi.com/facts/indicators/SH.IMM.HEPB
This is, of course; The Greatest Fear of US public health officials: That any tolerance of a more baby-friendly immunization schedule would lead to plummeting rates of vaccine uptake, which would then cause Mass Outbreak, Disease & Death. Actually, this is not just The Greatest Fear; this is a known fact, we are told, due to our diligence in Science-Based Medicine.
This is why doctors in a state that has eliminated personal exemptions for vaccines, are being disciplined for granting medical exemptions. This why we are told that baby-friendly immunization schedules should be avoided: "It's not science-based medicine".
I can only assume that Canadian public health officials have informed the Canadian public that their HepB vaccine policy/procedure is also Science-Based Medicine? The difference between Canadian uptake & US uptake is an 38% discrepancy, which is large enough to be very statistically significant:
"It is time we offered all children in Canada protection from hepatitis B from the moment they are born, as already happens in most developed countries — and also many developing countries."
It appears the Canadian approach to hep B vaccine is different but not better.
Be careful comparing infant mortality rates. Canada does not count a birth at less than 500 grams a live birth. The US counts it as a live birth if it has a heartbeat, gasps, or moves. That means that US stats are skewed by counting those very immature fetuses - who at this point cannot be saved even with intensive care. It not only skews the infant mortality numbers, it also affects the under five numbers.
In the US, the same was true for the 5 to 9 year olds, but the rank was reversed: accidents, then cancer. In the 10 to 14 year olds, it was accidents, suicides, then cancer.
Homicide was the fourth leading cause from age 1 to 14.
I suspect we could devote an entire thread to suggestions on how to improve those stats for the US, but I do not see anything to suggest that the US and Canada are fundamentally different. What would you suggest that the US do to "get it right" as far as preventing accidents and cancers in the 5 to 14 age group is concerned? Note that influenza, pneumonia, and sepsis are in the top ten for both of those age cohorts in the US. Many of those deaths are preventable with vaccination - following a schedule that gets kids protected as fast as possible.
Doctors are not being disciplined for providing legitimate medical exemptions, only fraudulent ones.
Leaving babies vulnerable to vaccine preventable diseases longer than necessary is not being "friendly" to them.
Measles has been completely eliminated from the entire Western Hemisphere. The only way it gets to the US is by importation from a region where the virus still circulates in the wild. If those regions sustained a high enough vaccination rate, measles could be eliminated there, too, with potential for eradication of the virus completely, worldwide, as was done with smallpox. Therefore, deaths from measles are 100% preventable with effective vaccination programs, because such programs eliminate circulating measles. No measles, no deaths.
Measles had been self-eradicating here in the U.S. since at least the year 1900; when there were 13 deaths from Measles for every 100,000 people (page 93 of https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/vsus/vsrates1940_60.pdf).
Since the total US population was 76,212,168; this indicates that there were 9,907 deaths, or that Measles killed 0.01% of our population. By 1920; there were 9 deaths from Measles for every 100,000 people & our population was now 106,500,00.
This would indicate that there were 9,585 deaths, or that Measles killed 0.009% of our population. 1940: Death rate was 0.9 per 100,000. Population was 132,100,00. 1,188 deaths or 0.0008% of the population.
I hate math. In 1960 the Measles death rate was 0.1 per 100,000. Population was 180,700,000. I'm not even going to bother but in 1964 the Measles vaccine was licensed.
No one would have died if they had not gotten measles.
I suppose you are right. The 0.0008% of the U.S. population that died from the Measles in 1940, wouldn't have died if they hadn't gotten Measles & in EU; 0.2% of those who got the Measles did die but the other 4,435 people who got the Measles, actually didn't die.
Wait. What was the point again?
Oh yeah: "Measles = The Death Pox & without the vaccine, we all die so make it compulsory & discipline the doctors who adjust the schedule by 1-3 months."
Measles had been self-eradicating here in the U.S. since at least the year 1900; when there were 13 deaths from Measles for every 100,000 people (page 93 of https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/vsus/vsrates1940_60.pdf).
Since the total US population was 76,212,168; this indicates that there were 9,907 deaths, or that Measles killed 0.01% of our population. By 1920; there were 9 deaths from Measles for every 100,000 people & our population was now 106,500,00.
This would indicate that there were 9,585 deaths, or that Measles killed 0.009% of our population. 1940: Death rate was 0.9 per 100,000. Population was 132,100,00. 1,188 deaths or 0.0008% of the population.
I hate math. In 1960 the Measles death rate was 0.1 per 100,000. Population was 180,700,000. I'm not even going to bother but in 1964 the Measles vaccine was licensed.
Before the vaccine 1 or 2 out of a 1000 people who got measles died from it. Today, 1 or 2 out of a 1000 who get measles die from it. Many who do not die have permanent handicaps from the disease, including hearing problems and intellectual impairment. In addition, measles causes an immune deficiency that can last two to three years after recovery, increasing susceptibility to other infectious diseases.
The difference pre and post vaccine is that before the vaccine virtually everyone had measles, usually by the teen years. Today, since most people are vaccinated, virtually no one gets measles - unless someone, who is usually unvaccinated, brings it into the US from another country. Measles has been completely eliminated from the Western Hemisphere, and it was the vaccine that dunnit. Measles was not "self-eradicating." It did not disappear until the vaccine was introduced.
Quote:
In the 6-month period between August of 2016 to January of 2017; Great Britain reported 575 cases of Measles ... despite having a vaccine uptake rate of 92% since 2012.
That just shows that 92% for one dose of measles vaccine is not enough.
"In March 2000, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention convened a panel of experts to review the pattern of measles transmission in the United States. Each participant concluded that measles was no longer endemic in the United States [16]. To prevent reestablishment of endemic measles transmission, the experts also recommended the following: maintaining the highest possible vaccination coverage (>90% among preschool-aged children and >98% among children aged 4–6 years); maintaining and improving epidemiological and laboratory surveillance to detect and respond to new importations of measles virus; and advocacy and provision of resources and technical support for measles control and elimination efforts in other countries, to reduce the risk of future measles importations."
However, the UK has now eliminated measles. The cases noted in the link were before 2016 or were imported cases.
"Dr Mary Ramsay, head of immunisation at Public Health England, said: 'We are delighted that the WHO has confirmed that the UK achieved measles elimination in 2016 and that rubella elimination continues to be sustained.
'In addition, national vaccine coverage of the first MMR dose in 5 year olds has hit the WHO 95% target.
'This is a huge achievement and a testament to all the hard work by our health professionals in the NHS to ensure that all children and adults are fully protected with two doses of the MMR vaccine.'"
Quote:
In the 6-month period between August of 2016 to January of 2017; Romania reported 1,995 cases of Measles, ... despite having a vaccine uptake rate of between 88-98% since 1989.
“'We still have in the media, gossip shows with different celebrities of dubious taste, who provide all kind of "magic methods" for child immunity, without vaccination, but who capture public attention much more than scientific information,' she told Vaccines Today. This is increasing the percentage of those who became suddenly anti-vaccination or at least hesitant. Dr Herdea says that 20 years ago, vaccination rates were above 95%. Today, she believes uptake fluctuates between 75% and 80%."
The low uptake is the reason measles still circulates in Romania.
Romania: Between 1 January 2016 and 16 June 2017, Romania has reported 7 233 cases, including 30 deaths. A possible 31st death is under investigation. Cases are either laboratory-confirmed or have an epidemiological link to a laboratory-confirmed case. Infants and young children are the most affected group. Forty-one of the 42 districts have reported cases, Timis (West part of the country at the border with Serbia) is the most affected district with 1 167 cases. Vaccination activities are ongoing in order to cover communities with suboptimal vaccination coverage.
Italy: Since the beginning of 2017 and as of 11 June, Italy has reported 2 988 cases in 18 of the 21 regions. Among these, 237 are healthcare workers. The median age is 27 years, 89% of the cases were not vaccinated and 6% received only one dose of vaccine.
UK: On 6 June, Public Health Wales reported four cases in a high school in Newport, Wales. During the first three months of 2017, England reported 17 confirmed cases, compared with 37 between October and December 2016. Northern Ireland has reported one case and Scotland has reported no cases so far this year. In late December, 2017, cases in the UK were linked to Italy and Romania. All received less than two doses of the vaccine.
"The national vaccination coverage was 95% for one dose [22]. This shows that high national or regional vaccination coverage cannot guarantee the prevention of outbreaks. All of these outbreaks were linked to communities that had low vaccination coverage. Many of the affected people were not vaccinated. ...] These studies demonstrated the dangers of under-vaccinated pockets, even in countries with generally high vaccination coverage (>95%), and showed the importance of the timeliness of vaccinations and catch-up vaccinations."
"The outbreak started as a cluster of three cases notified on 20 December 2016. The 2016 index case was a Belgian resident who had travelled to Romania during the incubation period and this case was most probably imported."
"China has more than 1 billion people, but 1 billion is a nice round number so I am just going to round down. With a 95% vaccinated rate, that leaves 50 million. Those 50 million unvaccinated Chinese are not evenly distributed throughout China, if they were herd immunity rates would truly be satisfied. One study in China showed that nearly 12% of parents moving to the city from rural areas had not vaccinated their children.
What is happening is that vaccination coverage varies depending on geographic region, and despite high overall coverage, susceptible pockets of the population still exist. "
Quote:
I suppose you are right. The 0.0008% of the U.S. population that died from the Measles in 1940, wouldn't have died if they hadn't gotten Measles & in EU; 0.2% of those who got the Measles did die but the other 4,435 people who got the Measles, actually didn't die.
Wait. What was the point again?
Oh yeah: "Measles = The Death Pox & without the vaccine, we all die so make it compulsory & discipline the doctors who adjust the schedule by 1-3 months."
0.2% is one in 500. That is a high death rate.
What about all of those who survive but are handicapped or get other infections because of the damage measles did to their immune systems? They do not count, I guess.
The doctor who was disciplined did not "adjust the schedule by 1-3 months." He gave a medical exemption for all vaccines based only on the mother's description of events that do not justify an exemption.
Bottom line? The examples in your post show why high levels of vaccination against measles are necessary.
Measles had been self-eradicating here in the U.S. since at least the year 1900; when there were 13 deaths from Measles for every 100,000 people (page 93 of https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/vsus/vsrates1940_60.pdf).
Since the total US population was 76,212,168; this indicates that there were 9,907 deaths, or that Measles killed 0.01% of our population. By 1920; there were 9 deaths from Measles for every 100,000 people & our population was now 106,500,00.
This would indicate that there were 9,585 deaths, or that Measles killed 0.009% of our population. 1940: Death rate was 0.9 per 100,000. Population was 132,100,00. 1,188 deaths or 0.0008% of the population.
I hate math. In 1960 the Measles death rate was 0.1 per 100,000. Population was 180,700,000. I'm not even going to bother but in 1964 the Measles vaccine was licensed.
I suppose you are right. The 0.0008% of the U.S. population that died from the Measles in 1940, wouldn't have died if they hadn't gotten Measles & in EU; 0.2% of those who got the Measles did die but the other 4,435 people who got the Measles, actually didn't die.
Wait. What was the point again?
Oh yeah: "Measles = The Death Pox & without the vaccine, we all die so make it compulsory & discipline the doctors who adjust the schedule by 1-3 months."
In no way was measles "self-eradicating". Until the vaccine came out in 1963, virtually everyone got measles by age 19; 50% had it by age 6. Everyone born before 1957 is considered to have had measles disease. Everyone. An estimated 4 million people got measles every year pre-vaccine. 30%, that is 30% of everyone, had some type of complication. 30% of 4 million is 1,200,000, and that was every year. In 8 years that was almost 10 million people! Some of these complications were permanent, such as hearing loss and loss of mental capacity. https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/pubs/pi...loads/meas.pdf
Your comment about math speaks for itself.
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