Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
I think what has concerned people is that there was no real "evidence" of abuse other than a phone call.
However, I am sure the local authorities have been waiting for some reason to go investigate the situation in that compound.
And altho I have not known of a situation personally, I have read of other situations across the USA that have involved an allegation about child abuse being made even by anonymous phone call, and the children being taken out of the home until an investigation has been completed. I have been concerned about such actions as it seems awfully disruptive and traumatic to go in and take children out of their parent's custody and put them in the state's custody while doing an investigation - that could be proven to be completely false.
So I think this is what people are wondering about.
Thanks Ani, you seem to get my point!
I too have read stories about children being removed based upon a suspicion...that was never completely proven, the parents being forced to complete a host of tasks before they could get their child back.
One story I saw on TV involved a teenage girl (who was always sneaking out and getting into trouble) who called and said her stepfather was abusing her. He said they had gotten into an argument and he grabbed her arm to stop her from running out of the house to get in a car with a much older boy. He admitted he lost his temper. They removed his three young boys during the "investigation" (the boys were traumatized) and he was ordered to go to anger management classes. Even the wife was only allowed to visit her sons at a facility with a court monitor. They got their sons back, 9 months later...and during court ordered therapy sessions the girl admitted she blew it out of proportion.
No, the police have a right to investigate but they should not have the right to remove children from their homes based upon a suspicion. If my daughter falls and gets a really horrible bruise and they suspect that I beat her they can't just take her away...
I think you are overexaggerating a bit. Kids don't get taken out of homes for 1 bruise. Or even a broken arm..or two. There is a way to tell if a bruise or a break is from abuse or from an accident, working with kids as a pedi nurse I know it well. And in this case the police knew what was happening at this ranch for some time and had no way of stopping it because the ranch hid these victims...do you know how SICK those cops must have felt day to day? They got their opportunity and ran with it. What if it had been 5 more years before the next opportunity came along?
There is a reason these pregnant teens are denied birthing in a hospital BTW - that right there would start an investigation and this sect knows it and hides it. Heaven knows how many young teens have lost their babies at that ranch due to the refusal of medical treatment. Is that not murder?
It is pretty hard to take a child from a home nowadays! Sure, you hear of alleged instances where the state just came in and whisked a child away "for no reason" and usually there is more to the story than meets the eye. When's the last time an abusive parent has admitted it right off the bat? I've yet to meet 1.
And too often children die or suffer years of abuse because there is noone there to help them. Everyone in this country is entitled to freedom and happiness and the hardest job is to protect the weak. I've seen kids who suffered incest/sodomy and abuse for years before the state took them out of the situation.
It is a big mistake IMO to try to equate this radical polygamist sect into everyday life and your parenting. This is so far from normal..and the gory details will come out in due time.
Again, you seem to not be hearing me. The issue is not "it's ok that these people abused children"...the issue is the process by which these children were taken from their parents. They have a Fifth Amendment right to not answer questions, silence does not indicate guilt. I don't trust the government, I'm not likely to answer questions should an officer come to my home with or without a search warrant. That doesn't mean I'm guilty of anything.
Yeledaf is right, a lifestyle choice is not a reason to persecute someone under the law.
But if everyone refuses to identify who is the mother of which child, then how can the authorities identify which children are at risk? They have to take all the children and question them. And if the women who were on the television refuse to cooperate then how will the authorities know they are returning the children to non-abusive homes and parents? I agree that lifestyle choices shouldn't be reasons for persecution, but this goes beyond a lifestyle choice. Polygamy is against the law in this country. Forcing teen-age girls to marry significantly older men and have babies is against the law. The religious tenets of these people basically serve as coercion to force these girls to comply. Coercion of any person to gain compliance in an illegal act is not allowed.
I agree with Mama Bee that there should be strong evidence before authorities enter a home and remove children, but the authorities knew from the testimony of people who had actually fled this sect about what was going on. The phone call was credible, evidently the girl provided details that matched ex-members stories, and the phone call suggested that a current member of the sect felt threatened and in danger, and that she was in a position to press charges. If it turns out that she was an ex-member, there will undoubtedly be repercussions, but determining if any of these children face abusive situations before returning them to their parents seems appropriate. The possibility that she was a current member, and that she was taken away or worse prior to the raid, makes the threat to these children all the more worrisome.
If this sect wishes to continue to practice their religion as envisioned by Mr Jeffers, it seems to me that they need to find a country somewhere that is sympathetic to them. In the meantime, the adults involved in this are not only making a choice to practice their religion as they see fit, they are also choosing to knowingly break laws passed to protect women and children.
Long after she escaped a polygamist Colorado City, Arizona, community in 1986, Flora Jessop found another way to escape -- cocaine.
Flora Jessop says she ran away from a polygamist sect in 1986 after being married to her cousin. "It killed the pain. It killed the hurt," she said. "I didn't have to hurt so bad because I missed everything I knew."
It's not wrong for a women of 14 or 16 years old to marry. The Bible says a women is a women when they reach puberty. A girl that has reached puberty is a women. The Bible says that if a man rapes a women he is to be taken to court.
program#601
Tony Alamo's Audio Programs #600-614 (http://www.alamoministries.com/audiomessages/programs7.htm - broken link)
ok, i am sure we will get along just well, as friends. I get along with kids and teenagers quite well. Though it seems mostly girls like me. But even if I don't agree with the laws, I won't start a romantic relationship with your daughter, even if she wanted to.
Some say The parent of Jesus were Joseph, in his 20s ans Mary 12 or 13.
Uh, yes, but that was 2,000 years ago, in a different culture, when the average person was lucky to live to be 40 years old. The life expectancy of women was lower because they often died in childbirth. It was fairly common for men to be young widowers and looking to remarry, too. That's why Jewish law has so many instructions about widows and widowers, and the community cared for the poor among them.
My parents were barely 18 when they got married but they would have been OUTRAGED if I had wanted to marry that young.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
