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Old 02-13-2022, 12:17 PM
 
18,490 posts, read 8,314,397 times
Reputation: 13801

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oh well....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Corrie22 View Post
On December 5, 1994 the leaders of Ukraine, Russia, Britain and the United States signed a memorandum to provide Ukraine with security assurances in connection with its accession to the NPT as a non-nuclear weapon state. The four parties signed the memorandum, containing a preamble and six paragraphs.

The United States of America, the Russian Federation, and the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland,

Welcoming the accession of Ukraine to the Treaty on the Non-Proliferation of Nuclear Weapons as non-nuclear-weapon State,

Taking into account the commitment of Ukraine to eliminate all nuclear weapons from its territory within a specified period of time,

Noting the changes in the world-wide security situation, including the end of the Cold War, which have brought about conditions for deep reductions in nuclear forces.

Confirm the following:

1. The Russian Federation, the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland and the United States of America reaffirm their commitment to Ukraine, in accordance with the principles of the Final Act of the Conference on Security and Cooperation in Europe, to respect the independence and sovereignty and the existing borders of Ukraine.

2. The Russian Federation, the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland and the United States of America reaffirm their obligation to refrain from the threat or use of force against the territorial integrity or political independence of Ukraine, and that none of their weapons will ever be used against Ukraine except in self-defence or otherwise in accordance with the Charter of the United Nations.

3. The Russian Federation, the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland and the United States of America reaffirm their commitment to Ukraine, in accordance with the principles of the Final Act of the Conference on Security and Cooperation in Europe, to refrain from economic coercion designed to subordinate to their own interest the exercise by Ukraine of the rights inherent in its sovereignty and thus to secure advantages of any kind.

4. The Russian Federation, the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland and the United States of America reaffirm their commitment to seek immediate United Nations Security Council action to provide assistance to Ukraine, as a non-nuclear-weapon State party to the Treaty on the Non-Proliferation of Nuclear Weapons, if Ukraine should become a victim of an act of aggression or an object of a threat of aggression in which nuclear weapons are used.

5. The Russian Federation, the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland and the United States of America reaffirm, in the case of Ukraine, their commitment not to use nuclear weapons against any non-nuclear-weapon State party to the Treaty on the Non-Proliferation of Nuclear Weapons, except in the case of an attack on themselves, their territories or dependent territories, their armed forces, or their allies, by such a State in association or alliance with a nuclear-weapon State.

6. Ukraine, the Russian Federation, the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland and the United States of America will consult in the event a situation arises that raises a question concerning these commitments.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclea...weapon%20state.
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Old 02-13-2022, 12:19 PM
 
13,495 posts, read 4,313,979 times
Reputation: 5402
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocko20 View Post
Yes.

Russia has demonstrated they don't play by any rules. They have nothing to lose, that's what makes them so dangerous. They have no morals or ethics.

They literally purged their own military officers while Hitler was invading them, that's how crazy they are.
and We play by the rules? LMAO! They have nothing to lose? What are they suicidal crackheads or extreme jihadists? They want self preservation.

Weren't the Soviet Union our allies during WW 2 and they were a key part of ending the war? The Cold War is over for over 30 years. I'm surprised many are stuck there.
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Old 02-13-2022, 12:23 PM
 
Location: Some Airport Transit Zone
2,776 posts, read 1,844,362 times
Reputation: 857
Quote:
Originally Posted by westcoastforme View Post
What exactly is this war going to be over? Land?
Your question here is the same as if tourists asked a blind man which road they should take next.
The answers of the posters here are reminiscent of an ignorance contest in which fantasies of any kind are allowed.
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Old 02-13-2022, 12:26 PM
 
Location: Some Airport Transit Zone
2,776 posts, read 1,844,362 times
Reputation: 857
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocko20 View Post
Russia has demonstrated they don't play by any rules. They have nothing to lose, that's what makes them so dangerous. They have no morals or ethics.
Looks like you are talking about the US.
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Old 02-13-2022, 12:26 PM
 
13,495 posts, read 4,313,979 times
Reputation: 5402
Quote:
Originally Posted by Goofball86 View Post
No one knows the true reason why Putin is amassing 100k forces on the Ukraine border its all specualtion at this point.

Because he can. It's their country. I would put 3 times that and tell Ukraine and NATO (It's really the U.S.) who are corrupting them, I mean business. The U.S. has over 750 military bases in 80 countries around the world and spends more than the next 10 countries combine in military but Russia putting their troops on their border is now a threat? ok
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Old 02-13-2022, 12:33 PM
 
Location: Stillwater, Oklahoma
30,976 posts, read 21,668,526 times
Reputation: 9676
Quote:
Originally Posted by MMS02760 View Post
Putin would like the old Soviet system where they controlled much land outside Russia. It served as the buffer zone from the west. The closer ties of many of these lands to the west with many now members of NATO makes them nervous. Ukraine is not a NATO member and there are no present plans to change that. Putin however does not like that the pro Russian president Viktor Fedorovych Yanukovych was removed from office back in 2014 and Russia no longer controls Ukraine. Yanukoych was basically a Russian puppet and now lives as an exile in Russia. Shortly after he was removed from office, Russia attacked the Crimea region of Ukraine and later annexed it. It had strategic significance being on the Black Sea. Many experts think that Putin may attack the Ukraine again in order to put a puppet back in office that would be controlled by Russia.
After from the past having been invaded by France and Germany in massive military campaigns that nearly defeated Russia, there should be no surprise Putin wants buffer countries between it and Russia that are not very pro-Western and certainly no member of NATO.
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Old 02-13-2022, 12:34 PM
 
Location: Honolulu, HI
24,679 posts, read 9,493,949 times
Reputation: 23011
Quote:
Originally Posted by musiqum View Post
Looks like you are talking about the US.
It makes no difference. The world isn't big enough for two competing ideologies with nukes.
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Old 02-13-2022, 12:39 PM
 
Location: Lahaina, Hi.
6,384 posts, read 4,840,581 times
Reputation: 11326
Quite a few posters have mentioned Russia's need for a "buffer state" from Western Europe. This seems like cold-war mentality since it is unlikely that there will ever be another conventional land-based war between superpowers. Why would they care about a buffer zone?

Nuclear-tipped missiles fly over a buffer zone in seconds.

Re-capturing their former breadbasket seems to be a more logical reason. Even then, it hardly seems worth the penalties that will be imposed upon them if they do invade.
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Old 02-13-2022, 12:54 PM
 
Location: Some Airport Transit Zone
2,776 posts, read 1,844,362 times
Reputation: 857
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocko20 View Post
It makes no difference. The world isn't big enough for two competing ideologies with nukes.
No, you are mistaken here. If you could be unbias and take a look at Russian points more closely you would notice that they have both morality and ethics, in which they adhere to international law and signed agreements. The problem is that - the western corporate media keep brainwashing its public with their demonization of Russia, misinterpretation and lies. And many people trust them.
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Old 02-13-2022, 12:59 PM
 
Location: Lahaina, Hi.
6,384 posts, read 4,840,581 times
Reputation: 11326
Quote:
Originally Posted by musiqum View Post
No, you are mistaken here. If you could be unbias and take a look at Russian points more closely you would notice that they have both morality and ethics, in which they adhere to international law and signed agreements. The problem is that - the western corporate media keep brainwashing its public with their misinterpretation and lies. And many people trust them.
So, Russia, good.

USA, bad.

Got it!

BTW: Which one is about to invade another sovereign country?
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