Obama deprive Washington DC kids of education his girls have? (money, society)
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Location: The Chatterdome in La La Land, CaliFUNia
39,031 posts, read 23,055,018 times
Reputation: 36027
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Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent
That's what I don't get - especially when taxpayer money ALREADY goes to private schools at the preschool and post-secondary level. They choose continuing to dumb down generations of students and crippling the nation's societal and economic futures, over funding effective private schools at the K-12 level so that ANY willing student can develop their potential.
It's time for them to admit what exactly it is that they gain from keeping students dumbed down. Is it a not so subtle form of racism? classism? both?
It isn't the private schools that are dumbing down our kids... But it's your tax dollars so I guess this is ok for you. Most property owners and tax payers are sick of funneling money to a school system that isn't doing its job. No amounts of getting involved is going to change that. We've tried this approach for decades and parents are fed up!
Public schools are delivering exactly what they promise -- the best free, universal education that the money and other resources they have available will allow.
Voucher proponents promise great improvements...both in voucher schools and, through the supposed magical stimulus of competition, in public schools as well. No voucher program has ever delivered any such thing.
Private schools as a group do not outperform public schools as a group once their respective student populations are made statistically comparable. That is, even by eliminating all of the most difficult children through simply refusing to admit any of them, private schools do not gain any advantage in educational outcome over public schools.
Being a student at a supposedly under-performing public school does not restrict one to being an under-performing public school student. Even if one attends that rare public school that offers no advanced courses for more motivated and accomplished students, the determined child of determined parents has avenues for expanded learning available for the taking.
Those trouble-making, poorly performing students who help to make a school a poorly performing school will not turn into model students upon the unlikely event of being accepted into a voucher school. They will still be trouble-making, poorly performing students.
You both make valid points, sadly you have to have to take a test to drive but you deliver a litter with no qualifer at all, ask octomom.
When my granchildren arrived for kindergarten they were reading at a end of first grade level maybe beyond that. Cat in a hat, no problem. My kids are afflent and after 6 months of hell raising, they moved and then sold, soon as they found out the school was going to be classified title one. I see bot sides.
Most of this I pin on dunce W Bush with his no "child left behind" Horrible program and federally the push is for underacheivers, future drop outs and the normal and gifted kids get screwed. We need to fix this.
I fully believe by the 7th no later than the 8th grade the malcontents, slow (read dumb, 70 to 90 IQ) troublemakers, lazy, and other not suited for college prep should be cut out of the herd and an approiate direction of education be offered. There is no reason kids have to go to college and take World History, American History, Algerbra 1 and 2. Geomotry English comp and English lit should all be done and taught at the college level in High School. Get the dead wood out of the classroom and let the kids that give a damn get in there and scratch. This way the teacher does not hve to drag her/his feet for the underacheivers.
We need big changes and the sooner we get the kids that are in the way out of the way, and maybe into an educational program parterned with business to provide the non degreed people that would be satisfying to the kids involved. From military to receptionist, not all people can surrive in college, nor do they want to. The ones that want to walk around with their belt line dragging the ground, getting into drugs, violence, crime and generally being gangsta cool, the sooner we get them into jail the better. Hell that is their destination anyway.
Those trouble-making, poorly performing students who help to make a school a poorly performing school will not turn into model students upon the unlikely event of being accepted into a voucher school. They will still be trouble-making, poorly performing students.
Your statement above shows clearly you have missed the point those who support vouchers are making
It is that those "trouble-making, poorly performing students" will REMAIN in public schools - parents who want vouchers want to get THEIR CHILD AWAY from those "trouble-making, poorly performing students".
Leave the bad students where they are. Let the good students have a chance at a better education by allowing them out.
Well, at least you admit that you don't really give a rat's a$$ about all of those inner city kids supposedly trapped in under-performing schools. Take your 1% or 2% and then leave the rest to rot...very nice approach...
It isn't the private schools that are dumbing down our kids... But it's your tax dollars so I guess this is ok for you. Most property owners and tax payers are sick of funneling money to a school system that isn't doing its job. No amounts of getting involved is going to change that. We've tried this approach for decades and parents are fed up!
I fully agree with you. And I don't think it's okay to keep wasting taxpayers' money on public schools that are dumbing down students that are capable of much more. It shouldn't be okay for anyone else, either, but I guess some people firmly believe that a dumbed down populace is good for society.
I like saganista's idea:
Quote:
Originally Posted by saganista
I'm one of the 'I want my money back if you can't deliver what you promised' crowd.
Let's get the taxpayers' money back from the public schools for every undereducated student so we can use that money more productively in a school, public or private, that will actually educate each student. We can use value-added testing instead of the flawed NCLB testing to ensure each child is making educational progress commensurate with their effort/ability.
I disagree.
If your school is that bad, get out there to the board meetings.
People complain about "nanny state" mentality, yet they don't accept responsibility for what's going on in their own neighborhoods and school districts.
Parents are responsible for their kids education as well as those of us footing the bills.
You want private, you pay for private.
You want parochial, you pay for that, too.
+1,
Amazingly enough.
When schools suck theres usually a reason & more often than not its a lack of involvement by the parents. We pay for it, its our responsibility. Just like if you paid tuition you'd pay attention & not tolerate a second rate education.
I kind of doubt that theres not enough money for DC to have a great school system. The people there just need to make education a priority.
When schools suck theres usually a reason & more often than not its a lack of involvement by the parents. We pay for it, its our responsibility. Just like if you paid tuition you'd pay attention & not tolerate a second rate education.
I kind of doubt that theres not enough money for DC to have a great school system. The people there just need to make education a priority.
What do you suggest for the involved parents and their children who want to learn and want a more challenging education, but can't get that in their public school? They DON'T want to tolerate a second rate education, but they have no other choice. What do you suggest when decades of parent and community advocacy does not improve the low-quality education that is the only thing available to willing and able students in the public schools?
Location: The Chatterdome in La La Land, CaliFUNia
39,031 posts, read 23,055,018 times
Reputation: 36027
Quote:
Originally Posted by saganista
Well, at least you admit that you don't really give a rat's a$$ about all of those inner city kids supposedly trapped in under-performing schools. Take your 1% or 2% and then leave the rest to rot...very nice approach...
And your approach is to leave them all 100% of them in the public school to "rot" then? You have the problem kids which may or may not gain anything from the public school system but are mandated to be there by law and then you have the remaining kids who have potential. Since the public school system takes a one-size-fits-all approach, not enough resources are devoted towards the kids who have the potential of academic success because too many resources are being used for dealing with the problem kids who are lagging behind.
And your approach is to leave them all 100% of them in the public school to "rot" then?
My approach would be for every public school to provide the best education that it possibly can. Public schools aren't responsible for the students who walk in the door. They are what they are. Some will make the best of their opportunity, some won't. Some you can reach, some you can't. Feel like your kid is stuck in an unpromising public school? Talk to private schools nearby. Almost all of them have financial aid programs. Taxpayers have for a long time agreed to provide a free public education to anyone and a free private education to no one. You're so gung ho for private? Work out the details on your own.
Quote:
Originally Posted by msconnie73
Since the public school system takes a one-size-fits-all approach, not enough resources are devoted towards the kids who have the potential of academic success because too many resources are being used for dealing with the problem kids who are lagging behind.
Don't know about the public schools where you are. My local schools have Advanced Placement, Gifted & Talented, International Baccalaureate, and Foreign Language Immersion programs. They also have ESL, team-taught classes, IDEA programs, and separate facilities for any habitual trouble-maker types. That doesn't fit my concept of the term one-size-fits-all. If your schools don't offer these types of tailored programs, why not? Maybe you should ask them.
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