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With your $19K you can purchase a nice house here in MI.
Every time government gets involved with something (GSEs, labor, taxes, business, education, entitlements, transportation, etc.) it invariably ends up becoming a complete disaster. My state with its 19% unemployment and rampant home forclosures is a perfect example of what is wrong with socialism.
hahahaha, maybe it's actually the fluoridated water, pal!
[Mod edited] Socialism IS the people's rights, civic rights.
Look up the world socialism on ex. wikipedia.
Socialism is NOT a political system. Its NOT communism. Its equality and civic rights to the people.
Even the tax havens with the greatest congregation of tax free wealth, are supported through a socialist service systems... explain that one to me, will you!?
Unfortunately it seems that to open the mind to other possibilities is unfamiliar territory to the smug and the arrogant.
I have some amazing friends and family in the USA and they seem to be (hopefully) the silent majority.
To imagine the kind of closed minds that are often on here to be the majority in America is frightening. The reason we see more of them is because they are more vocal and more afraid and that is why they scream so loud
Last edited by TnHilltopper; 10-26-2009 at 09:51 AM..
Because many of us started off at $19,000 a year, but worked our tails off to achieve more. To become the best at what we do and we're rewarded for it. Giving you money, just so you don't feel bad, isn't going to help you.
Success and wealth is a mindset. It's not a certain amount. If you sit there and feel sorry for yourself, or feel like you're going to be stuck where you're at, guess what...you'll never make it out of your hole.
What are your goals in life? With a name like "Las Vegas Drunk", I'm led to believe that you're more concerned with partying than being a big boy and becoming responsible for yourself. You're touting that you like to party, or that you're an alcoholic. Either of which isn't going to help you dig out of the hole you put yourself in.
Why should money be taken from those of us that have worked hard for it, and given to you who isn't doing anything to better themselves?
That'll give you a little extra money, and you'll blow it, putting yourself right back where you are. That's why so many lottery winners go broke so quickly. When you EARN something, you respect it more. When you're GIVEN something, you have no respect for it.
You don't DESERVE anything, so get off your tail, stop complaining and do something to better yourself. Be an adult and take responsibility for yourself. Stop worrying about what others can give you, and go get it your damn self.
Ouch. He nailed you perfectly, LVD.
BTW, have you bought a copy of The Big Book yet? You can have mine if you can't afford to buy one yourself. I'll only give it to you if you're serious about confronting your problem, though. I'm not going to waste it on someone who's not interested in improving themselves.
[Mod edited] Socialism IS the people's rights, civic rights.
Look up the world socialism on ex. wikipedia.
Socialism is NOT a political system. Its NOT communism. Its equality and civic rights to the people.
Even the tax havens with the greatest congregation of tax free wealth, are supported through a socialist service systems... explain that one to me, will you!?
[Mod edited]
Thank you for providing the wiki definition, since it clearly states that socialism is not a political theory (which it the proper realm of civil liberties), but an economic system where the means of production are owned by the people.
No where on the wiki page claims that socialism is about civic rights. You are clearly the one who is misinformed and claiming that tax supported welfare programs are socialism. It is you that is using the brainwashed definition of the right and equating socialism with the welfare state.
As for your tax havens, what socialistic services are you referring to?
EDIT: And to expound on your lack of knowledge, "Karl Marx and Friedrich Engels used the terms socialism and communism interchangeably"--from the wiki page that you advised me to read.
Last edited by TnHilltopper; 10-26-2009 at 09:53 AM..
First off, I will admit I am not very educated political wise. However, I am sure many of you are, and can educate me on this. I keep hearing how Obama is a socialist, and that is why he is bad. I am very poor (I make 19k a year), and have been my whole life of 34 years. I have never even had a job offer me health insurance. I was watching television the other day, and Obama made a statement that I really agreed with, he said something in the lines of taxing the super rich (over $250,000 a year) more, to make so everyone, such as myself, can have health insurance. I can not see why anyone would not agree with this? I really hate the cash for clunkers program he did, but this has restored my faith in him. To make a long story short, how is socialism going to negatively affect someone poor like me? I did a little research, and found that countries that are run a socialistic government have no homeless people. Can we say the same?
Socialism isn't bad at all.....in fact, countries that adopt social democratic policies tend to have the highest life expectancies, lowest levels of crime and less disparity of wealthy as those with fewer social programs, i.e. the United States.
Socialism is seem as a precursor to Communism, which it is not. Socialism can exist hand-in-hand with a free market system, ensuring checks and balances and ensuring that the weakest and most vulnerable people in society aren't left behind and abandoned.
[Mod edited]
Thank you for providing the wiki definition, since it clearly states that socialism is not a political theory (which it the proper realm of civil liberties), but an economic system where the means of production are owned by the people.
No where on the wiki page claims that socialism is about civic rights. You are clearly the one who is misinformed and claiming that tax supported welfare programs are socialism. It is you that is using the brainwashed definition of the right and equating socialism with the welfare state.
As for your tax havens, what socialistic services are you referring to?
EDIT: And to expound on your lack of knowledge, "Karl Marx and Friedrich Engels used the terms socialism and communism interchangeably"--from the wiki page that you advised me to read.
Well, you can read but your reasoning doesn't seem to work. People who post ignorant drivel like that only ridicule themselves. Its like someone claiming that slavery exist everywhere in america and that all people die from gunshots, no matter how many times you tell them this is not the case. Your arguments about socialism sound just as absurd.
If a communist leader has used a term interchangeably - what does that have to do with socialism or their own communist rule, that exercise complete control over their people and deprive them of freedom? The discussions on healthcare talks about social medicine, the European model. You don't even know that USSR is not socialist! You don't know the difference between socialism and communism. Socialism is an emphasiz on equal and just civic and social rights to the citizens. Pretty much like the US constitution, written by the European ancestors of this country.
Social services in tax havens; the same I have already mentioned. Health care, sick leave, maternity leave, paid vacation and on and on. There is no tax in these havens, except for VAT. Yet they have created a system that covers everything.
Instead of arguing on topics related to other countries you have never visited and know little of, why not try to find what is good from other systems and what part of it can be used in this country to improve the condition for the people?
Last edited by TnHilltopper; 10-26-2009 at 09:54 AM..
Well, you can read but your reasoning doesn't seem to work. People who post ignorant drivel like that only ridicule themselves. Its like someone claiming that slavery exist everywhere in america and that all people die from gunshots, no matter how many times you tell them this is not the case. Your arguments about socialism sound just as absurd.
More sophomoric replies from you, but I expected as much. It is clear that you do not have a proper understanding of socialism, but rather an armchair definition of it. You have clearly not demonstrated that socialism is about civil rights and you have been erroneously using it, when a welfare state is the more appropriate definition.
Your ad hoc definitions are no better than the far right's.
Quote:
If a communist leader has used a term interchangeably - what does that have to do with socialism or their own communist rule, that exercise complete control over their people and deprive them of freedom? The discussions on healthcare talks about social medicine, the European model. You don't even know that USSR is not socialist! You don't know the difference between socialism and communism. Socialism is an emphasiz on equal and just civic and social rights to the citizens. Pretty much like the US constitution, written by the European ancestors of this country.
And you didn't even know that Marx and Engles used the terms interchangeably. Most contemporaneous Marxists will claim that the Soviet Union was not communistic, but a form of state capitalism. Giving your lack of knowledge, I have doubt that you have read any Marx or Engles. If you had, then you would realize that the USSSR was not what Marx advocated for. It was a state and it had classes.
Communism is a stateless, classeless society. That is far from what the USSSR was. It had layers of bueacratic classes and a monolitic state. If anything, I would advise you to look into Yugoslavia or Mondragon for better fitting examples.
Quote:
Social services in tax havens; the same I have already mentioned. Health care, sick leave, maternity leave, paid vacation and on and on. There is no tax in these havens, except for VAT. Yet they have created a system that covers everything.
And social services != socialism.
Quote:
Instead of arguing on topics related to other countries you have never visited and know little of, why not try to find what is good from other systems and what part of it can be used in this country to improve the condition for the people?
First, I know better that that European countries are not socialistic countries. Only a idiot would believe that drivel. They are more like capitalistic welfare states.
And second, I have no problem finding out what is good for this country, but I don't appreciate your strawman argument. I would endorse a public option that is self-funding and not-for-profit that helps covers people with pre-existing conditions and adds competition which will hopefully drive down costs and hopefully increasing wages and business profits. Considering our government history to work hand and hand with big businesses, I do have my doubts, as the lobbyists are already on board wheelin' and dealin' which will probably lead to more crony capitalism at the expense of the people.
Norway is prosperous because they have an abundance of valuable natural resources (oil, timber, etc.). They'd be even more prosperous if they'd discontinue their socialist policies. Stop comparing apples to oranges.
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I really hate the cash for clunkers program he did, but this has restored my faith in him. To make a long story short, how is socialism going to negatively affect someone poor like me? I did a little research, and found that countries that are run a socialistic government have no homeless people. Can we say the same?
