The Progressive Enemy From Within & Our Options

[doctorhugo]

We can argue 'til the cows come home as they say and resolve nothing. I definitely and unequivocally believe what I said. You likely diminish the fact of he being a puppet of the globalists also. You also fail to acknowledge the unrivalled debt load that he was more than willing to pile ever higher and higher and how it effects us. China and a few foreign investors are literally keeping us alive economically by buying our debt instruments. Do you understand what happens when they stop buyung them? He understands that, yet still could care less as even now he pushes on to try to somehow get Oba-care through. Even after the State of The Union speech where he lied again saying we must only spend what we can pay for.

If you read my posts you know I equally nail Bush and his boys. Both Bush and Obama have sold out to the globalists NWO agenda.

[delusianne]

Originally Posted by doctorhugo

We can argue 'til the cows come home as they say and resolve nothing. I definitely and unequivocally believe what I said. You likely diminish the fact of he being a puppet of the globalists also. You also fail to acknowledge the unrivalled debt load that he was more than willing to pile ever higher and higher and how it effects us. China and a few foreign investors are literally keeping us alive economically by buying our debt instruments. Do you understand what happens when they stop buyung them? He understands that, yet still could care less as even now he pushes on to try to somehow get Oba-care through. Even after the State of The Union speech where he lied again saying we must only spend what we can pay for.

If you read my posts you know I equally nail Bush and his boys. Both Bush and Obama have sold out to the globalists NWO agenda.

He's never wavered from PAYGO since before he was elected.

and looky here: Paygo: Democrats approve pay-as-you-go legislation | The Star-Ledger Editorial Page - NJ.com

[swbtoo]

Read here to see how well pay-as-you-go has worked in the past. Unless real changes are made, don't expect it to work any better under Obama's oversight. Presidents and Congresses always found a way around it, and still will. Especially with pole-vaulting, parachuting Pelosi around.

Paygo applies to entitlement programs only, not to discretionary spending; the underlying premise is that no taxpayers get relief unless politicians stop spending, and I don't see that happening any time soon. Discretionary spending should be capped. Obama's announced "spending freeze" only applies to the budget, not to discretionary spending. Very clever to leave that loophole.


Rules and Ethics in “The People’s House” (http://74.125.113.132/search?q=cache:k2QqSGxSk9kJolicy.house.gov/files/PAYGO.pdf+pay+as+you+go+government&cd=6&hl=en&ct=c lnk&gl=us - broken link)

[doctorhugo]

He's never wavered from PAYGO since before he was elected.

and looky here: Paygo: Democrats approve pay-as-you-go legislation | The Star-Ledger Editorial Page - NJ.com

Trouble is that PAYGO proposals are far from a comprehensive and WORKABLE framework for budgetary enforcement. They contain too many loopholes, are needlessly complex and ultimately unlikely to contribute to significantly improving our fiscal outlook. The much bigger problem though delusianne and feel free to check this out, has been that the Oba-administration has NOT , repeat NOT, proposed multiyear spending caps for 'discretionary spending', which comprises about 40 percent of total budget outlays. That is one of those cutesy terms they use like "off-budget expenditures"...HA! Another lawyer's joke on the taxpayers. Including Medicare's doctor payments and the extension of numerous 2001 and 2003 middle-class tax cuts, which are scheduled to expire at the end of next year,the 10-year cost of the 'loopholes' is about $3 trillion. Ouch! Didn't that hurt?

You can't win on this one. That's why the only solution, as BOTH parties do this crap, is to ban lawyers from running for congress, but how do you do that with lawyers all over congress? You dump all the b*stards in November and push the newbies to reform the budget laws. As long as there are lawyers they'll craft everything with built-in loopholes and abuse the public trust.

You've got to dig beyond the headlines and one-sided commentaries don't-cha-know to pry out the truth and this was it. And the Oba-monster is a law professor...whew!

[harborlady]

Originally Posted by stillkit

If you know anything at all about how our political system works, you'll know that a third party candidate has about as much chance of being elected as an ice cube in hell. It's just not going to happen. Worse, even if one were elected to the White House, he/she would have NO support in Congress and would end up being shafted worse than Jimmy Carter.

Here's a tip for the loyal opposition: How about finding, and running, REAL conservative candidates and not just more pretty-face, faux-conservatives hiding behind that lable? How about divorcing the Republican Party from their corporate bag men on K Street?

Our country has had quite enough of the likes of George Bush, Sarah Palin, Mitt Romney, Mike Huckabee and the whole host of other closet big-government corporate toadies beholden to Tom Delay and the Evangelical's.

Unless, and until, the GOP returns to it's roots and kicks out the Neo-Con's, they'll continue to be a threat to our liberties and our national sovereignty.

You wanna effect REAL change? Stop the pie-eyed dreaming and go into the Republican Party swinging against the powers that run it now.

I have every reason to believe that the cesspool in GOP is the enemy within. Republicans have been misled for many years. That characters like dr hugo would continue to cling to the notion that 'it's everyone else' is classic evidence of mental illness pervasive in republican ideology playing out in media.
I no longer hear republicans renounce rush limbaugh, beck, hannity, or orielly as NOT representing them. These are the al sharptons of the republican party. I cannot endorse this party with a vote until they clean up house. They cannot clean up house until they take a very painful look at themselves and realize once and for all that THEY have been the enemy within.

[jertheber]

Originally Posted by doctorhugo

Given this comment...



You and I have a much different definition of what a "progressive" is. The true "progressives" were those who always beleived that THEY knew best for everyone and tolerated NO difference of opinion. If you want an example Obama is one. Alinsky another. Marx another. Progressives always share one thing in common. They seek 'control'...PERIOD!

You have a constitutional republic. Why not respect it and show some integrity? This constant railing against things corporate defines simpletons. People who cannot bring themselves to understand that without a functioning, free-market, capitalist system you will have tyranny by government. The Founding Fathers experienced the rule of The Crown and that's why they left and embarked upon this "great experiment". When the left demonizes the world of commerce they leave only one avenue open as history shows us. The road to the unilateral rule of assorted despots. The proof is all through the record of history.

The "founding fathers" were pretty busy writing out the construct that defined who could and who couldn't vote, no land? No vote for you. A woman? no vote for you. Black? Well, you know that story, Native? get out of "our"country. Yes, the planting class that started this "great experiment" were nothing but business men pissed off at the fact of Crown taxes. Of course many of those who actually fought the Brits were later disappointed to find their new masters looking just like the old ones.

It's Obvious that the real US history has not been getting as much exposure as it should, but then I'm never surprised at the level of ignorance demonstrated by those loud talking folks who seem to have the answers to all our ills right in their pocket. There is no shortage of radio shouters who'd have us believing that we find ourselves in the mix today because we just don't have the right man in the Whitehouse.

Perhaps I will find someone to tell me of a time in recent memory that we weren't being screwed by those on top, was it the forties? Fifties? Sixties? When did "commerce" become the new state religion? I thought this was supposed to be a nation by and for the People, not commerce. Simpleton, that would be the guy who can't bring himself to do much more than wrap himself in the flag and curse all others as traitors.

Some guys just have a way of seeing the obviousness of a situation and call a spade a spade, heres what ol' Karl had to say that's relevant to our current capitalistic debacle, "Owners of capital will stimulate the working class to buy more and more of expensive goods, houses and technology, pushing them to take more and more expensive credits, until their debt becomes unbearable. The unpaid debt will lead to bankruptcy of banks, which will have to be nationalized, and the State will have to take the road which will eventually lead to communism"
-Karl Marx, Das Kapital, 1867


He of course meant to say that the government bail out of banks would be the equivalent of a communist/socialist victory over capital, he was wrong on that one, we can see now that we don't have communism, but what we do have is corporatism, and we'll soon see how this kind of tyranny differs from the harsh economic disasters of the Soviet style state economics.

[swbtoo]

Originally Posted by jertheber

"Owners of capital will stimulate the working class to buy more and more of expensive goods, houses and technology, pushing them to take more and more expensive credits, until their debt becomes unbearable. The unpaid debt will lead to bankruptcy of banks, which will have to be nationalized, and the State will have to take the road which will eventually lead to communism"
-Karl Marx, Das Kapital, 1867

He of course meant to say that the government bail out of banks would be the equivalent of a communist/socialist victory over capital, he was wrong on that one, we can see now that we don't have communism, but what we do have is corporatism, and we'll soon see how this kind of tyranny differs from the harsh economic disasters of the Soviet style state economics.

Don't be so sure that he was wrong. We don't have communism yet, but we may well be on the road that leads to it, if we don't change course.

[doctorhugo]

I have every reason to believe that the cesspool in GOP is the enemy within. Republicans have been misled for many years. That characters like dr hugo would continue to cling to the notion that 'it's everyone else' is classic evidence of mental illness pervasive in republican ideology playing out in media. (So..."Republicans have been misled for many years"...huh. By whom? And how? Stop being a leftie bomb-thrower with wild, lying assertions. Make a case for what you say or is that too much to ask? I noticed that you tried putting words in my mouth with>>> 'it's everyone else'. At least you didn't put quotation marks around that bilgewater assertion.)
I no longer hear republicans renounce rush limbaugh, beck, hannity, or orielly as NOT representing them. (You are 'precious'! Republicans have never renounced these folks, only you..., trying to paint yourself as someone you're not, would think that.) These are the al sharptons of the republican party. I cannot endorse this party with a vote until they clean up house. (Spare me the righteous indignation which is just too phony coming from you.) They cannot clean up house until they take a very painful look at themselves and realize once and for all that THEY have been the enemy within.(Is that a fact toots? Why not specify the HOW and WHY and WHO as I earlier requested?

I never suggested its everyone else's fault. As a matter of actual fact I roundly criticize Republicans along with demonRATs and Little Georgie-boy Bush along with Obama. Where you come up with that garbage I don't know.

You are obviously a liberal left-winger trying to parade yourself as an indignant Independent so you can take free potshots and 'appear to be' non-idealogical. In that you are identical to your Great Leader who said in his speech to the Republican caucus..."I'm not an ideologue. I'm not." How he got that out without breaking up amazes me, but he is an accomplished and proven pathological liar. Why are you so ashamed to admit to being a leftist? I can understand that..., your shame and humiliation, but that's no justification for lashing out at everybody else. Why would I criticize or otherwise bad-mouth those people you noted? All four do NOT represent the Republican Party. You know not whereof you speak and that's how I know you're a leftie.. Limbaugh and Hannity represent what I'd call a conservative view, but when you include O'Reilly and even Beck you become obvious. O'Reilly annoys me for being TOO MUCH down the midddle. Beck has taken great pains, sadly, to represent the mainstream point of view and he criticizes BOTH side and blames BOTH sides. What really annoys you lefties is that his ratings are skyrocketting, not from conservative viewers, but from a very broad spectrum of ALL Americans. He irks you, because he lays out the truth about Obama and the progressives. He does it with FACTS that are verifiable and you HATE that. Much easier to just lash out as you did here, totally devoid of real knowledge and fact.