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Location: where people are either too stupid to leave or too stuck to move
3,982 posts, read 6,685,474 times
Reputation: 3689
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Pickering
They look like doughnuts to me.
Lol sure . "Doughnuts " then why are they called voodoo cookies or what ever ? I was just explaining that the voodoo cookies are accurate and not racist
Yes, donuts generally eaten by white folks designed to look like scary black people are racist. Its okay, we understand, the cultural perspective is normal for Portland. How do they know its offensive when they dont know anyone who would be offended? Ever heard of the Coon Chicken Inn? But they just made burgers right?
I enjoyed reading this thread. I presently am living in Nevada and we are moving back to Oregon to be near our grown sons very soon. A daughter who was visiting her brothers mailed me down a Voodoo donut, and one of the maple bars with the bacon, and a Voodoo donut T-shirt. They both survived the post office trip and I put them in the microwave for about 12 seconds. They tasted freshly baked. I never thought the voodoo donut was racist. I had seen the place on the travel channel, and I told the kids it was someplace I would like to check out. It is a good tourist draw for Portland. I also want to check out the food 'pods' or trailers. LOL.
1. White Portlanders aren't trying to be racist... (quite the opposite, they want to think of them self as all inclusive freedom fighters and progressive civil rights warriors) They just are racist, because they don't understand black people (I don't pretend to know everything) but they probably have never seen the moment when a black person is devastated by an action or words a white person has said to them.
2. White Portlanders don't have very much interaction with black people. This makes them awkward, the media has warped their minds into greeting black people with weird hand shakes saying things like 'sup dogg' and thinking it's okay to say ni%%AAAA and other awkward things they saw on an episode of Boondoocks or Chapelles Show.
3. White people don't get "it", can never get "it", and never will get "it". The conclusion of the "N word" episode of South Park episode Stan Marsh said it best. "I get it....because I don't get, I'm not black so I will never understand."
4. There is really nothing 'racist' you can say to a white person that they will take offense to because when you are the majority there really is nothing that can be said. However, just one choice word, the way you act around a minority or exclusionary action can devestate a minority.
The only reason, I partially get it is because I have seen it first hand.
In Tucson AZ, at Levitz Furniture my friend Jevon and I walked into the store and were looking around, well J wanted to buy. 1st thing the Mexican teenager sales man immediately asked ME if he could help ME (he called me sir and was very polite). We got through 2 minutes and the man never acknowledged J was there. Until finally he said something about J's JETS jersey (he called him "man"). J finally asked him a question about a table and the dude immediately told him about financing options, when he had not brought that up with me.
Then I don't remember what happened but the sales me said he had to take a call then a few minutes later we saw him with an old white couple on the other side of the store. Then another sales associate (a white woman) walked up to ME, and apologized and said "I'm sorry sir, have you been helped." Visibly flustered J said, "hey man I think I'm going to shop around, let's go to Texas Roadhouse." When we got to the car he kinda looked like he was crying/mad, and "I said whats up man." In my best naive white person voice. " You didn't see that bull****?" "Uh, the prices on cheap Indonesian particle board furniture?" (I knew what it really was)
<with passion> "NO MAN! That racist bull****. That BS happens to me every Fu%$# week man, every week, I swear to God and I'm so tired of it. Those MotherFers didn't even want my money. They pretended I wasn't even there. Then that MotherF$%$ going on about payment plans, like I can't pay cash. Like, I don't make enough money. I got $hit on by an old white woman and a fu$#@@ mexican teenager that don't make a fraction of what I make, don't have a fraction of the credentials, do they have a masters degree, did they make it through OTS? NO! I have and yet I'm still made to feel like less than human because of the color of my skin, I'm so tired of this $h!t. "
,
At this point I don't know what to say. Somewhat scared.
So I say, "I don't know what to say."
Luckily he says "There ain't **** you can say. But you saw that right?"
"Yeah, I saw it"
Anyway. I still don't think there was a racist intent behind the design of the original voodoo doughnut.
If you read the NYT article about Gentrification of North Portland it proves my observation entirely.
That nurse that stands up and then somewhere in her civil rights speech says "what do I call you people?" and an old black woman says "Donna" AWKWARD.....
2. White Portlanders don't have very much interaction with black people. This makes them awkward, the media has warped their minds into greeting black people with weird hand shakes saying things like 'sup dogg' and thinking it's okay to say ni%%AAAA and other awkward things they saw on an episode of Boondoocks or Chapelles Show.
The only reason, I partially get it is because I have seen it first hand.
In Tucson AZ, at Levitz Furniture my friend Jevon and I walked into the store and were looking around, well J wanted to buy. 1st thing the Mexican teenager sales man immediately asked ME if he could help ME (he called me sir and was very polite). We got through 2 minutes and the man never acknowledged J was there. Until finally he said something about J's JETS jersey (he called him "man"). J finally asked him a question about a table and the dude immediately told him about financing options, when he had not brought that up with me. Then I don't remember what happened but the sales me said he had to take a call then a few minutes later we saw him with an old white couple on the other side of the store. Then another sales associate (a white woman) walked up to ME, and apologized and said "I'm sorry sir, have you been helped." Visibly flustered J said, "hey man I think I'm going to shop around, let's go to Texas Roadhouse." When we got to the car he kinda looked like he was crying/mad, and "I said whats up man." In my best naive white person voice. " You didn't see that bull****?" "Uh, the prices on cheap Indonesian particle board furniture?" (I knew what it really was)
.....
Intersting. The very thing happened to me some years ago when I went to an electronics store with a male friend of mine to buy a DVD player. Although the recorder was for me, the salesman insisted upon continuing to address my male friend even after we told him I was doing the purchasing.
Happened all the time when I was married and went shopping with my ex. Heck, another example was when my fellow female co-workers and I had to use a side door through an alley to gain entrance into a country club for a Christmas party one year where my boss was a member while the men walked through the front door. Boys only, no girls allowed. I felt like I was in an episode of "The Little Rascals."
So what do we conlude? All white salespeople are racist and sexist as well? Don't go where you are not wanted? Because you know what? I learned from those experiences. I refused to attend the party unless they let me through the front door.
The next time I went shopping for me with my male friend and was being ignored, I spoke up loud and clear so that the salesperson would know just who had the money because that's what it was all about. That and attitude. I know it's difficult, very difficult especially doing it politely. But there is a lot of satisfaction in putting someone in their place. If your friend can learn how to turn the tables on people for instance "Oh, did I say something about financing?" " "I'm sorry, you must be thinking of another customer," there is so much more satisfaction than ranting in the parking lot.
Ya' know, don't play the victim so you won't be the victim.
BTW, this white person has had lots of interaction with African American friends in Portland so don't make assumptions about everyone here.
So what do we conlude? All white salespeople are racist and sexist as well? Don't go where you are not wanted?
Well we don't. But what I am saying is this was happening every week to J. I couldn't imagine being treated like less of a person for simply being a different color. We don't know what it feels like but after seeing it first hand a few times, I can somewhat understand that it is pretty devastating and after a while you can really get a complex about it. J is a very intelligent man, but for him to go off like that, I could tell he was really hurting. He's not a sensitive or weak man by any account.
so to answer your question, In my opinion. Yes, Yes and Yes.
I get that you think it could just be coincidence and all had to do was be assertive and call the guy out, but I could tell it was exactly what J said it was.
J and I were separated by a good 50 feet. Even after I told the salesman I was not interested he ignored Jevon for another 3 minutes before making a backhanded comment about the Jets, never called him sir, almost had a disdainful indifference towards him as a customer. Some people might say that there was a kinship or the connection, but that is not the way I saw it.
I agree with how J handled it. He told me that he learned the hard way that anytime a black person tries to be assertive it ends up backfiring. His take was if he wasn't valued when he walked in the door then he would never be valued and any company that didn't value him the second he walked through the door was undeserving of his money. He hit them where it hurt the worst, he told other black families what happened, but people of all races took note. Other families had a similar experience with the company.
It was 2011 not 1961, and my wife was the victim of a good old white boy when SHE bought HER Ford Edge BRAND NEW.
They kept insisting that I come in. Why? It was her choice, her purchase, not mine. Every time she goes in for service they try to tell her a bunch of weird things that the car needs that she knows is not true but they still treat her like crap and think she knows nothing about cars. I personally don't know and could never know how that feels because I'm not a woman. As a middle-aged middle-class white male I never feel discriminated against, never really could.
My only point is that as white people we can't possibly understand what is or is not offensive to someone other than a white person.
These are my experiences.
Ya' know, don't play the victim so you won't be the victim.
If we can't understand what it's like to be the victim, on such a regular basis, then it's easy for us to say that. I would imagine after being discriminated against all the time. it takes it's toll.
Another friend told me she could use 8 syllable words, but it wouldn't make a bit of difference, because people would focus on the way she talks and not the content of the conversation.
We are all entitled to our opinions.
Last edited by AndyAMG; 05-24-2013 at 10:58 PM..
Reason: Really need to stop using my iPhone for this
I get that you think it could just be coincidence and all had to do was be assertive and call the guy out, but I could tell it was exactly what J said it was.
Absolutely not. I don't think that at all.
Quote:
If we can't understand what it's like to be the victim, on such a regular basis, then it's easy for us to say that. I would imagine after being discriminated against all the time. it takes it's toll.
There are plenty of ways to feel discriminated against especially for a woman growing up in the 50's and trying to earn a living over the decades. And I can certainly emphasize with J. The point I am trying to make is that yes, some of us can understand how it feels to be discriminated against. You cannot say all white people do not understand this because it simply isn't true.
But this is a thread about racism and discrimination about a particular group of people I get that is what the OP wanted to discuss. It's just that when I see someone say that none of us white people get it, well, I just have to say that some of us do because we have been there. And I know you may find this hard to believe but some of us white people actually do have African American friends too.
You wanna see racisiem, go shop in Gary Indiana and be white when you do.
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