Questions about racial issues in Portland (Green: camps, living in, professionals)

[Leisesturm]

Originally Posted by oregonwoodsmoke

Got to confess. Photos of the product don't make me feel inspired to jump into my car and drive over and buy donuts. But still not feeling the racist hatred, or even the insult.

Are you black? I think it's a fair question. Whether you are or not, the fact is, a lot of white people have strenuously voiced their objection to the notion that the donuts are racist. Really? How does that work, exactly? For the record, I don't feel the racist hatred either. But... it does beg the question: we all can agree the donut is not (any longer) racist. What is it then? Seriously, what is the blackface Voodoo Donut supposed to elicit in the buyer, the general public? From the small sampling of Voodoo offerings supplied for our review, it would appear that the blackface donut is an outlier product. All the others are race, gender or otherwise anthropormorphically neutral. What's that about then? I only posted at all earlier because, to me, it seemed a little surreal, a bunch of white people arguing the possible, or not, racist intent of something... anything... true.. hameller did solicit the opinion of a black ex to bring some perspective to the argument, but, I don't think that that goes far enough in search of balance. Neither she, nor I, are the best judges of what is truly racist because both of us in choosing white partners and spending (in my case anyway) ALL waking and sleeping hours in the exclusive companionship of white people... well, I think there are more qualified black people to venture an opinion on how offensive, or not, a race baited icon is to black people people. I do believe if you go back far enough you will discover that there has been outcry about the donut and what we see now is the politically correct, sanitized for your protection versions, Cross of David and all, to show no intent to defame or destroy. Whatever. The question was not rhetorical though... if we are going to continue beating this around, rather than speculate on what it is not. i.e. a racist image... does anyone have insight as to what, exactly this donut is supposed to be?

H

[Steve Pickering]

Originally Posted by Leisesturm

... ... The question was not rhetorical though... if we are going to continue beating this around, rather than speculate on what it is not. i.e. a racist image... does anyone have insight as to what, exactly this donut is supposed to be?

H

The business is called Voodoo Doughnuts. Mostly because there is something magical about them. Something Witchy. The VooDoo Doll Doughnut is representitive of their Business Name. If it were called Whichy Doughnuts it would be a Witch Doughnut charactor.

To say mentioning Voodoo is racist is a real racist streach.

[pdxMIKEpdx]

Overthinkers of the World.....Unite!

Donut.

[Deezus]

Originally Posted by Leisesturm

I do believe if you go back far enough you will discover that there has been outcry about the donut and what we see now is the politically correct, sanitized for your protection versions, Cross of David and all, to show no intent to defame or destroy.

Okay, where was that outcry in the past. The place has been around a decade now--it's been featured on travel shows(Bourdain's No Reservations, Man vs. Food, Globetrekker), it's been on an episode of the Amazing Race, it's been featured on other Portland set TV shows and movies; it get's written up in travel magazines and national media publications as a place to visit when one comes to Portland. The primary crowd for Voodoo Donuts these days is out-of-town tourists who line up around the block.

How come none of these people ever said, "That donut is racist!" and went back and wrote about it anywhere? I mean tens of thousands of people from all over the place must have saw that donut over the last ten years. Are all these people closet racists or did they just not percieve any sort of racial imagery in that donut to begin with?

If you googlesearch, Voodoo Donuts and "racist" or "blackface" the first results are basically this thread. So no, there never was a controversy about this donut, because apparently the average person viewing it isn't seeing a racial element to it.

[green_mariner]

Originally Posted by kyled

Why do you care? Maybe if people stopped nitpicking every single thing other people did no matter how insignificant we wouldn't have the more serious issues.

If your ethnicity had a history of being hated and constantly stereotyped, you would care.

[westboundrambler]

Green_Mariner, part of the reason race is still such a big issue is because people nitpick on little things like this. Let the little things slide. If someone is promoting or pursuing racially fueled hatred, then that's a time to fight. But you can't nit pick every little thing, especially things that were never intended to be racist, you'd go insane. Will always be racial tensions? Yes, but might as well keep them to a minimum by wisely choosing what is an actual issue and what isn't. Oh, and I may not be a black man with a history of slavery in America but I am a Jew who's ancestors were in Germany. Fortunately my great great grandfather moved here in the 1890s, but the rest of his family wasn't as lucky.

[hamellr]

Originally Posted by green_mariner

If your ethnicity had a history of being hated and constantly stereotyped, you would care.

You mean like white straight computers nerds?

Seriously though, one of the prevailing arguments against Affirmative Action by parts of the African American community is that same argument, by continuing to nitpick the little things, the big ones seem unsurmountable and never get resolved.

[phlinak]

Originally Posted by Deezus

Where you in the Seattle suburbs? Most people in central Seattle itself tend to be from other parts of the country originally...it's filled to the brim with transplants from the Midwest and Northeast.



But you chose to make it about racism for the entirety of Portland by your last paragraph in the original post. Which could be an interesting topic to discuss along with the history of Portland, but is completely separate from this silly donut...

The Voodoo Donut dolls vary on how the look depending on who is making them--they don't even all look like that. The whole gimmick is that it's a voodoo doll filled with jelly in the middle so you stab it and blood comes out...whoop-de-doo...

voodoo donuts doll - Google Search

All the same, I don't find that to be a "racist" image...because when I see that I don't see a representation of a black person or any sort of human. It's just some weird chocolate figure... I sincerly doubt anyone had any intention to make this a "blackface" representation. It's like asking what the ethnicity of Gumby or the Gingerbread Man is... If the voodoo doll had white frosting, you wouldn't care--unless the entire concept of voodoo-themed donuts you find offensive. In which that case, I'd tell you to lighten up..

Oh, no, he didn't!!!

[green_mariner]

Originally Posted by westboundrambler

Green_Mariner, part of the reason race is still such a big issue is because people nitpick on little things like this. Let the little things slide. If someone is promoting or pursuing racially fueled hatred, then that's a time to fight. But you can't nit pick every little thing, especially things that were never intended to be racist, you'd go insane. Will always be racial tensions? Yes, but might as well keep them to a minimum by wisely choosing what is an actual issue and what isn't. Oh, and I may not be a black man with a history of slavery in America but I am a Jew who's ancestors were in Germany. Fortunately my great great grandfather moved here in the 1890s, but the rest of his family wasn't as lucky.

I never thought about Voodoo's doughnuts until now, but I can understand where the OP is coming from. Perhaps the nitpicking taking place is sort of a way of saying "we don't take crap from anyone, period". Perhaps the problem is that there has never really been any trust as far as race relations go. It's hard to tell if someone is being racist or not, so many people assume the worst.

And I am quite aware of what Jewish people went through in Germany. That does not negate what has been done to Blacks in this nation. The OP is looking at this from what has been done to him.

Perhaps the doughnuts are being made an issue because of trust issues as far as race relations are concerned, because some people feel like some things stay the same. Perhaps it is hard to let "little things" slide because of the history of Blackface. It is hard to tell for some people. I honestly can't tell. Perhaps some Blacks will make a big deal about it because it is being viewed as "if you let someone walk on you once, they will do it over and over". Perhaps the siege mentality comes from having things done to other people. Perhaps it starts out as little things. I think about the Holocaust. It started out as someone writing a book, and then someone decided to act on what he wrote and then, well, many bad things happen.

[green_mariner]

Originally Posted by hamellr

You mean like white straight computers nerds?

Seriously though, one of the prevailing arguments against Affirmative Action by parts of the African American community is that same argument, by continuing to nitpick the little things, the big ones seem unsurmountable and never get resolved.

What exactly are you trying to say? What does computer nerds have to do with this?