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I don’t see the problem with the article. (I am a heterosexual male).
Sure, the author is a bit aggressive in her phrasing, and some of what she says lacks nuance, but it is a short article and the author was trying to make a point.
Looking at each point she made, if she were to soften the tone a bit, many people would agree.
Hitting the highlights, I do like women who have their own goals and motives, money and concerns. Sure, sometimes that means conflict may occur, but I don’t see that as a problem. The author implied that the independent woman would not yield when conflict arises, but for the most part human nature does require compromise. It’s just not as impactful an article if you stop every paragraph and say “of course there are times to compromise...”.
Well said. I thought the article was spot on.
Her last sentence is truth: "If you truly are attracted to strong, independent women – nothing in this blog will offend you or make you uncomfortable. Remember that"
Strong and independent woman translates to a woman who is strong-minded, very opinionated, quick to argue, or even a narcissist. A personality that is loud and defensive. Independent means free of "something".
Translation: likely a job with no boss and no committed intimate male relationship.
It means only what the person who says it thinks it means. It could mean "I'm financially independent and career minded." It could mean "I'm emotionally warped and want to keep men at arm's length since I'm afraid of emotional entanglements." It could mean "I'm not going to be anyone's doormat." It could mean "I'm extremely averse to a romantic partner that's going to expect me to do anything other than what I want to and what I decide."
In my personal limited experience, the last description is what fits to those that self describe as such. But its a vague term. I find it difficult if I'm going to smile and wear the sweater that your meemaw knitted for me and go to thanksgiving if you're going to stamp your feet and refuse to wear nice clothes to a nice dinner that my parents are inviting us to.
Her last sentence is truth: "If you truly are attracted to strong, independent women – nothing in this blog will offend you or make you uncomfortable. Remember that"
I still want to know which women are weak and dependent, and who determines that.
She could have written about experiences she or women she personally knows have had and been more specific. Who are these guys? She said men on forums - I wonder which types of forums. Did she personally date men who fetishized her because of her achievements and lifestyle and tried to change her? Such an article would have been more interesting.
I still want to know which women are weak and dependent, and who determines that.
She could have written about experiences she or women she personally knows have had and been more specific. Who are these guys? She said men on forums - I wonder which types of forums. Did she personally date men who fetishized her because of her achievements and lifestyle and tried to change her? Such an article would have been more interesting.
Are you really contending that there are not dependent women? Or men for that matter? And that you would rather she write an article about that?
So your criticism of the article she wrote is that it wasn’t the article you wanted? I suspect the author would have responded that she is a strong independent woman and doesn’t need to write what you want, she can write what she is interested in.
At 21, I purchased my first condo as a single woman.
I capably supported myself on only my salary and traveled often. I didn't lack.
I am not ashamed to say that I "need" my husband. That's what happens when you've been married for almost 17 years.
I am not ashamed to say that it is no longer about me. We are a partnership, a union of two people. I brought a lot to the table, as did he. But together? Together we are raising two girls, who we will groom to be independent thinkers, self sufficient, and all around productive people with good morals and good hearts.
There is nothing wrong in saying that I need him in my life, his energy, his love. It took time for this to build, but it was (and still is) totally natural. We've been through so much together and have experienced so much together. He needs me in his life, and my energy, and my love. It is not one sided and the day it becomes that, we will part. both of us know that we have what it takes to make it without the other.... I can and will provide for my children regardless. I don't need to constantly tell him how strong I am either. It's understood. I don't have to prove a thing.
Her last sentence is truth: "If you truly are attracted to strong, independent women – nothing in this blog will offend you or make you uncomfortable. Remember that"
I can see why the general reaction to her is critical. I have no doubt there are men who may think they want "strong independent women" who fail at some of the points she makes, but I truly do wonder about the extent of that problem. A handful of anonymous guys on a few forums? Not all men are aloof buffoons after all. There are some pretty smart men out there who want "strong independent women" and go about it effectively. So I question the degree to which the problem she's addressing even exists. Again, if she's just responding to some posts some guys on forums have made...okay. First day on the internet maybe?
Also, while she makes an effort to acknowledge the diversity of the "strong independent woman" her overall tone undermines to me the degree to which she actually believes this. I wonder if she'd consider my SAHM/W to be a strong independent woman? I'd guess probably not. But does a woman have to be a career woman to be strong? Does a woman have to be economically independent in order to be truly independent? Or is this just "strong and independent" as defined by feminists such as this writer? I've even seen some feminists argue women shouldn't be SAHM/Ws but a lot of women make that choice to do that. But if it's her choice, is that not empowering in its own way?
I also agree with the sentiment some here have expressed about the idea of needing one's partner. Some have made the idea of need a bad thing. Need isn't a bad thing. Codependency is, but need isn't the same thing as codependency. Also, needing one's partner isn't mutually exclusive with wanting one's partner. In a healthy relationship there is a balance between both, and going both ways. Just because I need my wife or she needs me doesn't mean we don't also want each other.
The writer did get a handful of us here on CD talking about her article. Likely a few others on a similar forum elsewhere in the web world. So in that regard she likely achieved what she was going for. But there are dozens of blogs just like this and honestly there's nothing ground breaking here. It's pretty standard affair from this type of writer/blogger, complete with the "if this makes you uncomfortable you're part of the problem" style ultimatum. I believe that's a "no true Scotsman" fallacy. I'm sure it felt good to write, but the only people this truly matters to are the ones who already likely share her position on the matter.
Location: Huntersville/Charlotte, NC and Washington, DC
26,701 posts, read 41,783,055 times
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I’ll actually attempt to define a strong independent woman. You can credit the movie “Diary of a Tired Black Man” for this one. I consider a strong independent woman one who has the ability to weather life’s storms (with or without help) without compromising her character. That to me is a strong independent woman.
Now another term I’ll introduce is a “scrong ineffective woman.” This one states she is a strong independent woman but she is only that in her mind. She makes it a hallmark to scream the phrase and gets a rise out of being as insufferable and not relationship worthy as possible. Then she emasculates men who naturally don’t want to put up with her as weak.
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