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If it's only 40 and has structural issues, it may just be poorly built.
I concur also, I was expecting an 1850s-1890s house to have the problems he complains about. AND I was going to say: "what do you expect in a {so many years} old house?"
Back to the OP:
1] If costs of repairs are OVER $100k, WHAT is the price of the house? {here where I come from a whole house can be had for $100k}. Never mind, I remember the 'contents' of the house. 5 bath facilities alone here would skyrocket the taxes in to the stratosphere!
2] are you looking in "cheap cookie cutter" developments? If so, maybe that is the problem. They often went up fast and cheaply. AND they weren't concerned with building properly and, well, "good".
3} Your husband is WISE to not want a split the extra stairs can be a hazard especially for younger children, and a pain if you age in place.
4
4}Poured concrete foundations can be just as much a problem as cinder blocks. I would tread VERY carefully when considering a house with any foundation issues BEYOND hair-line settling cracks that show no moisture seepage of any kind. We are looking at houses to buy, and won't consider any foundation that shows ANY moisture seepage, OR one in a flood plain, OR one with even a sump pump!
5} Are you looking at houses perched on hills? THAT alone can be an issue, We looked at one poured concrete foundation ranch..PERFECT for us in every way, EXCEPT: the foundation had 3 cracks- from wall to floor to opposite wall in almost exactly in thirds across the the house on the hillside it was perched on! The basement wall MOSt in the hill had seepage in the bottom corner, and on the day we look it POURED rain, and the 2 dehumidifies with hoses running to the sump pump told a tale! EVEN without apparent water issues. a SLIDING HILL is Still a problem.
6} IF there are major foundation issues, the "content amenities" you list DO NOT outweigh the issues if the house collapses! They MAY be nice, but...
MOstly, it comes down to this: I, personally WOULD NOT BUY a house with foundation issues! NO matter how "perfect the rest is"! AS I said, we passed on the house, the yard was leveled out of the hillside, but, the foundation had, as I said split in thirds across the hill. The HOUSE WAS PERFECT for the two of us, was in foreclosure {maybe we could see why?} so cheaper for us, but, those darned foundation issues.
We are currently in contract negotiations on another nice house, a ranch {only kind we want}, and it has a few hairline settlement cracks. No moisture, Nothing, biggie: NO sump. The ONLY real Issue we are haggling over is... {besides price..they want seller's market prices but we are in a buyer's market here!!!} is a RADON mitigation system for the basement, not too expensive, a grand, but the seller KNEW abut it and failed to disclose it, and the sellers here usually pay for its mitigation system to be installed. They want us to pay the higher price a seller would get in the seller's market, but want us to install the system as well. NO WAY.
WE like the area, {we live here now}, but are going Sunday to look at 3 other homes in other areas, just because we NEED to get an "outside view"....
We have NO CHILDREN to worry about.. so that is not an issue...
Dunno, YOU have to be happy with the house, BUT if it has 'issues'.....I would steer clear of it entirely....There WILL be other houses! It may not seem like it.
I concur also, I was expecting an 1850s-1890s house to have the problems he complains about. AND I was going to say: "what do you expect in a {so many years} old house?"
Back to the OP:
1] If costs of repairs are OVER $100k, WHAT is the price of the house? {here where I come from a whole house can be had for $100k}. Never mind, I remember the 'contents' of the house. 5 bath facilities alone here would skyrocket the taxes in to the stratosphere! The house is $550K, and the demand is high here. One of the most ugly homes in the entire town just went contingent, I never thought it would. Orange siding, and "weeping" tuckpointing that looks like flaking skin. It's in the same middle and elementary school district as we want.
2] are you looking in "cheap cookie cutter" developments? If so, maybe that is the problem. They often went up fast and cheaply. AND they weren't concerned with building properly and, well, "good". NOOOOO! I'm sick of cookie cutter homes. The last two homes I had were new construction cookie cutters
3} Your husband is WISE to not want a split the extra stairs can be a hazard especially for younger children, and a pain if you age in place.
4
4}Poured concrete foundations can be just as much a problem as cinder blocks. I would tread VERY carefully when considering a house with any foundation issues BEYOND hair-line settling cracks that show no moisture seepage of any kind. We are looking at houses to buy, and won't consider any foundation that shows ANY moisture seepage, OR one in a flood plain, OR one with even a sump pump!The inspector couldn't find any moisture at all. We had a finished basement in our last home with a sump pump and a backup battery, and never had issues. I search the flood zone maps before I purchase. Would never purchase a home in a flood zone, or one that had moisture issues. This house has none, and it doesn't smell at all in the basement. It's finished beautifully too.
5} Are you looking at houses perched on hills? THAT alone can be an issue, We looked at one poured concrete foundation ranch..PERFECT for us in every way, EXCEPT: the foundation had 3 cracks- from wall to floor to opposite wall in almost exactly in thirds across the the house on the hillside it was perched on! The basement wall MOSt in the hill had seepage in the bottom corner, and on the day we look it POURED rain, and the 2 dehumidifies with hoses running to the sump pump told a tale! EVEN without apparent water issues. a SLIDING HILL is Still a problem. I wouldn't say this house is on a hill, but it is graded such that the land slopes nicely away from it
6} IF there are major foundation issues, the "content amenities" you list DO NOT outweigh the issues if the house collapses! They MAY be nice, but...
MOstly, it comes down to this: I, personally WOULD NOT BUY a house with foundation issues! NO matter how "perfect the rest is"! AS I said, we passed on the house, the yard was leveled out of the hillside, but, the foundation had, as I said split in thirds across the hill. The HOUSE WAS PERFECT for the two of us, was in foreclosure {maybe we could see why?} so cheaper for us, but, those darned foundation issues.
We are currently in contract negotiations on another nice house, a ranch {only kind we want}, and it has a few hairline settlement cracks. No moisture, Nothing, biggie: NO sump. The ONLY real Issue we are haggling over is... {besides price..they want seller's market prices but we are in a buyer's market here!!!} is a RADON mitigation system for the basement, not too expensive, a grand, but the seller KNEW abut it and failed to disclose it, and the sellers here usually pay for its mitigation system to be installed. They want us to pay the higher price a seller would get in the seller's market, but want us to install the system as well. NO WAY.
We had a radon mitigation system in our last house, and it's really worth it if you need it. The expense isn't that bad
WE like the area, {we live here now}, but are going Sunday to look at 3 other homes in other areas, just because we NEED to get an "outside view"....
We have NO CHILDREN to worry about.. so that is not an issue...
Dunno, YOU have to be happy with the house, BUT if it has 'issues'.....I would steer clear of it entirely....There WILL be other houses! It may not seem like it.
BEST of luck with the house hunt! Thanks! Good luck to you too!
The house we have a contract on now is perfect in every way for us, except one, huge foundation cracks, no seepage or water per the inspector, but the foundation is so cracked that it's affecting the brick outside (huge crack) and one of the windows has a gap between it and the crack. We're getting a highly recommended foundation repair company to come and give an estimate on the repair. What do I do if the owners won't repair the foundation issues, or offer a substantial credit toward the repair? I hate to really keep putting offers on houses and then retracting them. Would this even be a good investment if it did have major foundation repairs? The rest of the house, per the inspector, is fine. Great mechanicals, roof, windows, and it's in decent shape for a 40 year old home. Inventory right now is really low, and we can't find anything we like for our budget, which we increased by $100K. You wouldn't believe the crap people are selling for $600K and more.
This is so frustrating!!!!
Cracks in a home aren't necessarily anything to get worried about. They can be the result of settling or other factors. They don't always mean the foundation is in bad shape. Even if the foundation is damaged, the need for foundation repair isn't unusual, and is not something to get worried about. It can be completed in a few days even if you occupy the home. I had an extensive repair done while I still lived in the home (15 piers on a slab foundation). Here is Houston, virtually every home needs foundation repair at one time or another. And many 40 year old homes have had their foundations repaired multiple times. You are not going to find a 40 year old home in perfect shape. Think about it. 40 year old people show signs of wear and tear. And how many 40 year old cars are still on the road?
If you need to eat the cost of the foundation repair, maybe it's part of the cost of getting a home. If the home is in good shape otherwise, that's a sign that the home has been maintained well, actually. A good home inspector will find issues even in a brand new house. My wife is a home inspector, and the average length of her reports is 40 pages long. Because she is thorough, she looks for every single little flaw in a home. But many, if not most of them, aren't things to get worried about. Just find out what the foundation people say, get some estimates, try to negotiate with the seller, and if they won't, carefully consider purchasing this home anyway. After all, if the foundation is repaired right away, you won't need another one for decades, if ever, and it can be a good selling point if you resell. Do you really want to pass on a home to find another one that is probably in much worse shape than this one? Good luck!
The inspector said they were "significant" cracks in the crawlspace foundation, even for a 40 year old home. The masonry is affected as well, with stair cracking through the mortar, almost up to the roof of the home, and there is a huge gap between the window and the brick where it cracked. I understand that a 40 year old home will have settling and cracks, but foundation problems are not this significant on all homes this age. I don't think this is a routine problem on a home of this age, except maybe in Texas, where there is a lot of dry soil.
1) 3 full bathrooms, 2 half bathrooms)
2) four nice sized bedrooms
3) a ranch, which is hot in the area, as many older people like to move there. We have very elderly parents too, so this helps.
4) near a large park
5) super quiet street with a dead end
6) gorgeous finished basement with a bonus room (can be used as a bedroom or study) and a full bathroom/sauna.
7) no water issues that anyone could find
8) All other mechanicals are fine (HVAC, electric, plumbing) as well as windows, roof
9) Lots of curb appeal and it is an all brick house
10) open floor plan
11) It's all brick, no siding.
Now it does have some cosmetic issues, but I see that as a non-issue. I wish it were only cosmetic issues. Some updating has been done as some of the bathrooms, especially the master bathroom, is amazing, and all new hardwood floors in the recently remodeled great room (a wall was taken down to combine the living room/family room). It's dramatic and beautiful. It also has beautiful windows and a nice yard.
Now, does that outweigh the foundation issues? I don't know, so I'm kind of on a see-saw here trying to figure it out.
Quote:
Originally Posted by twodoor2
The inspector said they were "significant" cracks in the crawlspace foundation, even for a 40 year old home. The masonry is affected as well, with stair cracking through the mortar, almost up to the roof of the home, and there is a huge gap between the window and the brick where it cracked. I understand that a 40 year old home will have settling and cracks, but foundation problems are not this significant on all homes this age. I don't think this is a routine problem on a home of this age, except maybe in Texas, where there is a lot of dry soil.
Twodoor2, I believe your expectations are unreasonable. Read your first post and then your second. You obviously love the house, so why not do everything you can to get it? Unless you buy new, you rarely find the "perfect house." Inspectors use the word significant all the time. Significant means just that, significant. Foundation repairs cost a lot of money; I won't lie to you. It may cost $7000-$15000 and up. However, in return for the repair, you have a major fix done that will last your home decades, and maybe a half century before you need to get it redone.
Oh, and something else. It's not always necessary to repair cracks that occur from prior foundation damage after the foundation is repaired. The window, sure, but the cosmetic cracks in the interior aren't necessary. It's your call, but if I were faced with this issue, I'd probably move forward, even if I had to pay for the foundation repair myself. I actually appreciate the piece of mind I get from knowing the foundation has just been done because it won't need done again. Oh, and every foundation repair company offers a lifetime transferable warranty so you won't have to pay for the repair again if anything needs redone. If they don't, they aren't a reputable company.
Location: Stuck on the East Coast, hoping to head West
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OP have you considered getting a second opinion regarding the foundation issues? Particularly by someone local to the area who knows the foundation issues/houses?
Along those lines, how knowledgeable is this inspector? What is his/her trade before becoming inspector? Does your state regulate them?
In my neck of the woods, it doesn't take much to hang a shingle and call yourself a home inspector. Furthermore, there's not a whole of regulation or oversight.
Twodoor2, I believe your expectations are unreasonable. Read your first post and then your second. You obviously love the house, so why not do everything you can to get it? Unless you buy new, you rarely find the "perfect house." Inspectors use the word significant all the time. Significant means just that, significant. Foundation repairs cost a lot of money; I won't lie to you. It may cost $7000-$15000 and up. However, in return for the repair, you have a major fix done that will last your home decades, and maybe a half century before you need to get it redone.
Oh, and something else. It's not always necessary to repair cracks that occur from prior foundation damage after the foundation is repaired. The window, sure, but the cosmetic cracks in the interior aren't necessary. It's your call, but if I were faced with this issue, I'd probably move forward, even if I had to pay for the foundation repair myself. I actually appreciate the piece of mind I get from knowing the foundation has just been done because it won't need done again. Oh, and every foundation repair company offers a lifetime transferable warranty so you won't have to pay for the repair again if anything needs redone. If they don't, they aren't a reputable company.
Thank you for your opinion. It does differ from others on this thread. However, I obviously have to weigh my options no matter who's opinion it is. I cannot act on emotion. We'll see what the inspection report says (still waiting for it), and the contractor. I'll give an update at that time.
OP have you considered getting a second opinion regarding the foundation issues? Particularly by someone local to the area who knows the foundation issues/houses?
Along those lines, how knowledgeable is this inspector? What is his/her trade before becoming inspector? Does your state regulate them?
In my neck of the woods, it doesn't take much to hang a shingle and call yourself a home inspector. Furthermore, there's not a whole of regulation or oversight.
I'm in Illinois, and I went with a highly reputable inspection firm. Their people are highly trained, and have to be licensed. He spent over 3 hours at this home, going in crawlspaces, climbing on the roof, getting into every nook and cranny, as we followed him around. He even brought high tech equipment and a thermal moisture device along to "see" moisture behind walls. Their reports are very detailed and comprehensive, and they don't sugarcoat problems, but they try not to scare you either. In Illinois, EVERYTHING is regulated, LOL! This inspector has a comprehensive biography on their website, and he was a builder for many years.
Today, based on the inspector's recommendations, a highly reputable foundation repair firm is going to look at it and give us an estimate and determine how it needs to be fixed. I didn't get a structural engineer as of yet, but wondering if I should. Like I said, I don't want to give up on this house, but if the foundation is horrible and it will affect the value of the home significantly, that's really important to us. It's not like a bad roof or leaky windows, or a foundation settling crack that hasn't gotten bigger. These cracks are opening up, even upon prior repair, per the inspector.
What you NEED is an inspection by a licensed independednt structural engineer. S/he will provide you with a stamped report that will give you a professional opinion as to the nature and the cause of the foundation problems, and the recommended fix. I have had foundation fixes done on my present home (due to age and shock waves from the Navy base), and the recommendations by the independent structural engineer and the engineer who worked for a foundation company varied - widely. Guess whose recommended fix was MUCH more extensive AND expensive? Not the independent engineer's, that's for sure. Foundation companies want to use their products, so their engineers tend to recommend solutions that USE those products. The foundation company wanted to provide expensive solutions that were not necessary per the independent engineer's analysis and recommendations.
So, I strongly recommend that you engage an independent structural engineer to evaluate the situation ASAP if you truly want this house. It does sound as if the foundation problems are severe, but the engineer will give you the unbiased truth about the situation. And even if you decide to use the foundation company's piers, I would request that they provide scientific proof (i.e., engineering requirements) for their use. Piers are not necessarily the best solution for all foundation problems, btw.
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