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A neighbor on my street has expanded his house over the last 10 years to rent out. All were done without permit (he told me. his renters told me, police came, etc.. so I know).
However, at the end, he got it fixed up very well professionally, probably through some contractor knowing how to flip. All the additions look extremely legit from the structure perspective. In tax record, it is still showing 2000 sqft vs. MLS posting of 3000 sqft. So my questions:
1. It seems to be OK to bump up the sqft in MLS posting? I asked a agent friend and she said it is doable technically but they open a risk of being sue.
2. If yes on #1 above, what happen if they disclose to the buyers the house has been through addition and blah blah blah, wrong record or being too long ago, they cannot track sqft... wouldn't it be OK and not scare of buyers?
I am wondering what tactic they did as the house finally got sold for a good amount.
That is all very local stuff. Sometimes they simply ignore non permitted additions. Sometimes they send in an inspector and approve it all. Other places they may make you open walls and floors to allow inspection.
The seller of one should be pretty careful to disclose it. It may well still be saleable if you can convince the buyer that it is well done and that the buyer will not be hassled over it and may save money on property taxes.
too many assumptions without knowing the actual facts.
it's entirely possible the contractor that you mentioned came in and got it retroactively permitted. Just because the county hasn't updated the website yet means nothing.
However, IF it was never permitted, and they used an actual licensed Realtor/agent to list the home for sale, then that agent has opened themselves up for major liability, and a readily provable issue that might very well cost them 100's of thousands of dollars and possibly their license.
Wow Bo... We aren't required to KNOW whether work was permitted. And in our MLS, we're not responsible for the square footage accuracy. That's nuts. In fact our agreement states that it is up to the buyer to measure square footage or acreage to their own satisfaction.
When we enter the SF, we enter the number and the source of the info.... either seller, or assessor.
Wow Bo... We aren't required to KNOW whether work was permitted. And in our MLS, we're not responsible for the square footage accuracy. That's nuts. In fact our agreement states that it is up to the buyer to measure square footage or acreage to their own satisfaction.
When we enter the SF, we enter the number and the source of the info.... either seller, or assessor.
We are required to disclose what we know.
What DH said. It is not a shooting offense here either. The key though is it needs to be disclosed. And you have no real defense against a seller who lies. Now if you have a large discrepancy in SF from government and the client you should get to the bottom of it. But here there is little risk to the agent if the true nature of the discrepancy is disclosed.
I have one that will be very interesting. The seller has a bathroom in the garage with easy access from the pool. It is not claimed in the area (SF) of the home...but that is not the problem. The home has a septic system and if the authorities were notified of the existence of the garage john it is virtually certain they would require the septic system be redone. That would run around 20,000 as there have been vast differences in the requirements over the 32 years since the home was built. And this home may be worse as they have their septic tank buried under a heavy concrete slab used as an RV parking space.
The advice to the seller is disclose and make sure the buyer understands that if it ever becomes an issue you simply remove the bathroom. It is even possible you remove the bathroom...have it inspected by the authorities...wait a year and put it back. Cannot of course suggest it to the client but you could provide anecdotes where such a thing occurred.
Around here, you can add as many bathrooms as you want..... septics are rated for a number of bedrooms. You can't add bedrooms without potentially upgrading septic.
What you can't do here is leave the septic tank inaccessible... septic pumping and inspection is required at time of transfer by the county.
FWIW, the house where we grew up, the back patio had been poured on top of the tank, but we were able to cut a hole and access it, and then we put a planter there.
Around here, you can add as many bathrooms as you want..... septics are rated for a number of bedrooms. You can't add bedrooms without potentially upgrading septic.
What you can't do here is leave the septic tank inaccessible... septic pumping and inspection is required at time of transfer by the county.
FWIW, the house where we grew up, the back patio had been poured on top of the tank, but we were able to cut a hole and access it, and then we put a planter there.
The home has no access problem. Man hole in the slab. Our septic system uses a count of the number of faucets, commodes, tubs, showers. And the real problem is that around 15 years ago they changed the basic requirements. Went from a one tank to a two tank system. Obsoleted everything already installed. So if you put in even a small casita you give it its own system or connect it to the sewer/
Wow Bo... We aren't required to KNOW whether work was permitted. And in our MLS, we're not responsible for the square footage accuracy. That's nuts. In fact our agreement states that it is up to the buyer to measure square footage or acreage to their own satisfaction.
When we enter the SF, we enter the number and the source of the info.... either seller, or assessor.
We are required to disclose what we know.
in NC, we are required to have an accurate measurement using guidelines. Tax assessor calculation is not sufficient. We certainly use the given (tax page and other intertwined sources) info on the lot size. Certainly, a major discrepancy on either would be an issue
The issue we have with permitted/unpermitted square footage is that records don't go back more than ~ 9 years. On an older house, if the tax office shows some finished basement or 3rd floor, then it is reasonable to see some discrepancy between someone today physically "pulling a tape" and however it is the tax guy arrives at square footage. If my seller bought the home 7 years ago, and last time it was X sqft and now it's X+400 and the 3rd floor got finished ... 'Where's the permit?"
On septics - we're like Diana - it's limited to # of bedrooms. You could have as many baths as you want. And you can add as many "rooms" as you want. You just can't call it or market it as a (septic permit + 1) BR home.
A neighbor on my street has expanded his house over the last 10 years to rent out. All were done without permit (he told me. his renters told me, police came, etc.. so I know).
However, at the end, he got it fixed up very well professionally, probably through some contractor knowing how to flip. All the additions look extremely legit from the structure perspective. In tax record, it is still showing 2000 sqft vs. MLS posting of 3000 sqft. So my questions:
1. It seems to be OK to bump up the sqft in MLS posting? I asked a agent friend and she said it is doable technically but they open a risk of being sue.
2. If yes on #1 above, what happen if they disclose to the buyers the house has been through addition and blah blah blah, wrong record or being too long ago, they cannot track sqft... wouldn't it be OK and not scare of buyers?
I am wondering what tactic they did as the house finally got sold for a good amount.
Nothing they did was wrong. They just beat you at their own game.
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