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Not really a revelation. Pretty much common knowledge (except for here in CD land, apparently).
Yup. It's the difference between real life and CD PUA fantasy-land.
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Originally Posted by RogersParkGuy
...but isn't that true for men as well? I think it is.
This question came to mind after I finished reading a book titled "Promises I Can Keep: Why Poor Women Put Motherhood Before Marriage." It is a fascinating read. It reveals that a lot of behaviors among the poor that seem self-destructive actually make sense given their circumstances. But that's another discussion.
I would love to hear more about this. If you post about it on another forum, will you drop me a link?
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Wow. I did not expect the level of hostility I am getting here...
The level of misogyny on CDR is cyclical, have you noticed? (Might make a good study!) It appears to be about a 2-3 week cycle. Right now it's at its peak.
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Originally Posted by brocco
well youre only considering people who end up getting married, too. plenty of people have happy and healthy long term relationships and wont get married or will file income taxes separately or whatever due to differing finances. this is just a silly example but my bf has 50k in student loans. he makes enough to support himself and can do income-based payments on his loans so they're not so bad. yea he made some poor college choices lol. but i make a lot more than him so if we were to get married he'd have to start paying up on those loans. i got an earlier start on my career so he will probably catch up income-wise then it will make sense to get married, but for now it would cause us both more financial stress if we were to do so.
on a related note, how many of those "single women" have live-in, paying, signficant other to whom they're just not married?
Very interesting example. And I have seen a lot of situations like that, where couples make the decision of whether or not to marry based on non-CDR financial situations, IRL.
...but isn't that true for men as well? I think it is.
This question came to mind after I finished reading a book titled "Promises I Can Keep: Why Poor Women Put Motherhood Before Marriage." It is a fascinating read. It reveals that a lot of behaviors among the poor that seem self-destructive actually make sense given their circumstances. But that's another discussion.
What is relevant to this post is what the authors found out when they investigated why more poor women didn't marry in order to escape poverty. This was an important question, since married couples are far less likely to be poor than single women.
The answer: the better off, more economically stable men wouldn't marry poor women. In fact, in all of the communities the authors studied, the best off, most economically stable men and women tended to marry each other. No one, male or female, was interested in marrying anyone below their own economic level. On the contrary, both women and men consistently married partners who would enhance their own household income and raise their standard of living.
I think this is an interesting revelation...
Their is plenty of truth to this from my observation. As a man on the outside I can explain. I live in a low income neighborhood and I see the very same thing that you have expressed in your posts on why poor women have kids before they marry first. It is indeed an anomly. Prior or during the white flight in my neighborhood poor women who got pregnant either gave their kids up to orphanges or had a shotgun marriage and married their baby fathers to be. This is not the case anymore ever since the 1960s and the growing acceptance of the single mom. But again this is before I was ever born but I read up on this topic while reading about generational poverty some years back. I'm a financially stable guy but as well as college educated, in good health to some extent and still very young. Do poor women in my neighborhood like me, majority do not, why my life style is very different, my subjects and topics are also different, to a certain degree my fashion taste are a bit different like I don't wear Air Jordans but prefer to wear boat shoes. I only wear baseball caps to baseball games and not everyday on the street. So already their is a disconnect between me a stable guy vs a poor woman.
Another thing is that poor woman date along physical attraction lines and not economics compared to women who are wealthy and college educated types. Poor women date physically attractive men and have kids with them due to the fact that their offspring will be more healthy which is not always the case. In my neck of the woods plenty of average women who are chubby or look like whatever date good looking guys, bad boy types etc, many who dropped out of high school and ended up in jail. They are attracted to these guys and have in and out STR with these guys or hop on to the next guy. Guys like badboys, good looking guys in these poor environments may offer good genetics for women and their offsprings but do not offer financial support structure. Onetime I went to a job interview in my area at family court, saw the childe support department and it made me real sick.
Another thing I realized is that poor women do not need a man for money especially single mother types. Generally women like this either work have some sort of job, or even receive welfare with some sort of family contribution or sort. Even worse are the independent women who do not view their jobs a careers but as a profession, these women will tell you they don't need a man to support me, and many end up in relationships with useless guys, addicts, excons, high school dropouts, cheaters, deadbeat dats etc, these guys give these women thrill, excitement drama. I came across women like this who also become pregnant with men they dated who had issues and not economically stable, these women wanted to make it work because they really liked these type of lowlife men, I don't understand why? I can assume physical attraction but their might be more to it.
What I realized is that being stable, financially secure and educated is not the key to a womans heart especially when it comes to poor women. Yes men do often marry down, but when you marry down a man will have to face a whole new set of problems. I knew of guys who married down and are in relationships with women with one or two kids from another father. I know this lady who wanted to hook me up with her daughter, her daughter was cute, sexy latina, nice butt nice breast and so forth. I went out with her and she wanted a relationship, she was also a single mom of two kids, this is something that I could not do. I could not be a father of kids that are not mine and I belived that I was stepping out of my line, I let her go. She found a meaningful relationship with a new man who will raise her kids plus another one on the way. What I realize is this that poor women will have kids with these no good guys, badboys, pretty boys etc, but when the time comes will probably persue a stable guy later on in life or when its time to move up, and many caught in this stage of life will go seeking out a chump or a simp to be with for a LTR and maybe marriage if any.
Currently I have to date women or seek women outside of my city because there are to many extremes, stable guy caught in the middle, vs poor woman who does not want a stable man at the moment but also want to live for the moment. Most poor women or those who are not finicially secure tend to be in relationships with badboy type of guys, guys who they find physically attractive. Not to far from where I live is one of the highest earning per capita in the country plenty of wealthy people in this area and again wealthy women, and the educated women alike do not want a man that is stable, they want a man that is either wealthy, or already setup in life, his looks do not matter. If your an average but also stable and secure, you are going to struggle with women. Currently because of this two extremes that I have recently scene observed and experienced, I have to either date women outside of my city or pursue newly arrived women who come from other parts of the U.S.
Last edited by Bronxguyanese; 10-08-2013 at 10:53 AM..
I want a woman who'll actually want to enjoy her life rather than having lots of money, which is insanely over-rated. That would mean, a woman who would prefer to be a housewife, or mostly a housewife (maybe she can work part-time at a supermarket or wherever to get us health insurance, whereas in this economy I might have to be self-employed in the long run). Enjoying life means being a housewife? YES. WHO THE HELL WANTS TO WORK!?
I want a woman who'll actually want to enjoy her life rather than having lots of money, which is insanely over-rated. That would mean, a woman who would prefer to be a housewife, or mostly a housewife (maybe she can work part-time at a supermarket or wherever to get us health insurance, whereas in this economy I might have to be self-employed in the long run). Enjoying life means being a housewife? YES. WHO THE HELL WANTS TO WORK!? I feel like our society has gone nuts!. I would PREFER to do the cooking, and spend more time with the kids, any sewing necessary, have time to go to the gym in the middle of the day, etc. People are obsessed with their "wealth" nowadays as opposed to their lifestyle.
Then why don't you be a househusband while she goes off to work, if it's so great?
I wonder if the higher birthrates of lower income people has anything to do with it.
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Originally Posted by Broncos Quarterback
This should not be surprising. Higher classes marrying one another is one of the many reasons for growing inequality in America. It's well documented.
I think its both. Plenty of wealthy people do marry within their income strata which creates higher income bracket. Poor people often do not marry and if they do divorce can happen since the number one reason people divorce is due to money problems. One of the great reasons for income disparity is the rise of the single mother and fatherless families.
There's an interesting double standard when it comes to wealth and income. If a woman says she's looking for a guy who makes a good income and is financially stable, she risks being called a goldigger. But if a man has the same expectation, it's deemed perfectly reasonable. After all, what man wants to have a partner who's dependent on him and can't support herself? Actually I know exactly what kind of man, but I'll save that for the Politics forum.
There's an interesting double standard when it comes to wealth and income. If a woman says she's looking for a guy who makes a good income and is financially stable, she risks being called a goldigger. But if a man has the same expectation, it's deemed perfectly reasonable. After all, what man wants to have a partner who's dependent on him and can't support herself? Actually I know exactly what kind of man, but I'll save that for the Politics forum.
It's not as critical that a woman be a high income earner. More likely, she'll be at home with the kids.
Guys can't major in whatever they "dream" of or are passionate about. They have to major in something practical. Women, knowing in general, they'll probably (or are more likely to) get married and stay at home with the kids, can major in whatever they want: art history, languages, English, etc.
Location: RI, MA, VT, WI, IL, CA, IN (that one sucked), KY
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheektowaga_Chester
It's not as critical that a woman be a high income earner. More likely, she'll be at home with the kids.
Guys can't major in whatever they "dream" of or are passionate about. They have to major in something practical. Women, knowing in general, they'll probably (or are more likely to) get married and stay at home with the kids, can major in whatever they want: art history, languages, English, etc.
Ummm, I don't think that is the case so much anymore. Not like it used to be.
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