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Lol! I somewhat agree with your interpretation. Mostly men are not so much difficult to understand. But this thing is only applied when men understanding men. Don't know why its difficult for women or specially your women!
I believe there is a reason for this, and it's the same reason men sometimes think that men are simple.
Men are STRONGLY conditioned not to show emotional weakness, especially and critically not in front of other men. Men don't talk and share the way that women do with their female friends. Many male friendships are so centered around some particular activity (like sports, for instance) that they barely know anything beyond the basic vital statistics of the other guys' lives.
If a woman has a female friend who is in a divorce, she probably knows every detail about how that couple got to that point, at least from the woman's perspective. If a man has a guy friend who is getting a divorce, he knows the basic facts, from his male friend's perspective, but not the details.
So guys don't see the complex emotional nuance of their guy friends, and they assume that "guys" (at least the ones they know) are these simple, stoic creatures. But this is not the picture that men often present to women. Sometimes when a man is having complicated feelings, the ONLY person he is comfortable sharing them with, is his female partner. Sometimes those feelings are so bottled up and unexamined that we're left trying to play therapist and help our men sort through a lifetime of stuff. Or worse, maybe he isn't even comfortable sharing with his wife or girlfriend, and just bottles it all up all the time, but occasionally has an outburst or it sort of leaks out in small ways and we (women) are left trying to figure out what on earth is the motivation behind the behavior we have just witnessed.
But in general, (straight) men have more complex relationships with the women in their lives, than they do with the men, which is why men understand men...what isn't an unspoken but universally understood truth between them, is just avoided and never discussed.
1. Watch a contemporary (post-1980) sitcom featuring a long-time couple as central characters.
2. Observe how the woman treats her husband or boyfriend.
3. Take good notes, and remember them.
4. Do the opposite.
Hahah - she gets away with treating him that way because she's usually a 9-10 and he's about a 4 - so he's happy, regardless.
Back in the '50's-'70's on TV nobody looked all that great and you had women getting treated mostly like idiots so I think things are better now. It'll all even out in the end - just the pendulum swinging - be patient MU!
Hahah - she gets away with treating him that way because she's usually a 9-10 and he's about a 4 - so he's happy, regardless.
Back in the '50's-'70's on TV nobody looked all that great and you had women getting treated mostly like idiots so I think things are better now. It'll all even out in the end - just the pendulum swinging - be patient MU!
I think it's because of this: the men women settle down with aren't the men women naturally desire. Why? Naturally desirable men don't always make good long-term partners, and women know this. But without that natural desire to act as a glue, there's a cognitive dissonance of sorts. Which leads to resentment, which leads to anger, which leads to her treating him poorly. It happens even in sitcoms where both partners are of comparable attractiveness levels, like "Roseanne". By contrast, no such treatment happens in casual relationships, usually but not limited to shows depicting high-schoolers.
Oh, and by the time the pendulum swings in my direction, I'll be an old, old man. Oh well. <shrug>
I think it's because of this: the men women settle down with aren't the men women naturally desire. Why? Naturally desirable men don't always make good long-term partners, and women know this. But without that natural desire to act as a glue, there's a cognitive dissonance of sorts. Which leads to resentment, which leads to anger, which leads to her treating him poorly. It happens even in sitcoms where both partners are of comparable attractiveness levels, like "Roseanne". By contrast, no such treatment happens in casual relationships, usually but not limited to shows depicting high-schoolers.
Oh, and by the time the pendulum swings in my direction, I'll be an old, old man. Oh well. <shrug>
You have described a relationship of dysfunctional people.
Why in the heck would I be in a long term relationship with someone I didn't desire?!
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I believe there is a reason for this, and it's the same reason men sometimes think that men are simple.
Men are STRONGLY conditioned not to show emotional weakness, especially and critically not in front of other men. Men don't talk and share the way that women do with their female friends. Many male friendships are so centered around some particular activity (like sports, for instance) that they barely know anything beyond the basic vital statistics of the other guys' lives.
If a woman has a female friend who is in a divorce, she probably knows every detail about how that couple got to that point, at least from the woman's perspective. If a man has a guy friend who is getting a divorce, he knows the basic facts, from his male friend's perspective, but not the details.
So guys don't see the complex emotional nuance of their guy friends, and they assume that "guys" (at least the ones they know) are these simple, stoic creatures. But this is not the picture that men often present to women. Sometimes when a man is having complicated feelings, the ONLY person he is comfortable sharing them with, is his female partner. Sometimes those feelings are so bottled up and unexamined that we're left trying to play therapist and help our men sort through a lifetime of stuff. Or worse, maybe he isn't even comfortable sharing with his wife or girlfriend, and just bottles it all up all the time, but occasionally has an outburst or it sort of leaks out in small ways and we (women) are left trying to figure out what on earth is the motivation behind the behavior we have just witnessed.
But in general, (straight) men have more complex relationships with the women in their lives, than they do with the men, which is why men understand men...what isn't an unspoken but universally understood truth between them, is just avoided and never discussed.
Men are seen as "simple" because they tend to impulsively lean towards logic as a reaction over emotional.
It easier to break down issues to core components and solve them than focus on emotional response where things may be inconsistent or incoherent.
Males have no issues being vulnerable (or showing vulnerability) to each other as long as trust is present between them.
Men are seen as "simple" because they tend to impulsively lean towards logic as a reaction over emotional.
It easier to break down issues to core components and solve them than focus on emotional response where things may be inconsistent or incoherent.
Males have no issues being vulnerable (or showing vulnerability) to each other as long as trust is present between them.
I don't agree. I have seen far too many times, where a man immediately jumped to solve a problem with a violent temper tantrum (complete lack of emotional control) that I would have simply dealt with logically.
Oh, but anger doesn't count? Sorry. Yeah. It does.
The real difference, at least according to the beginnings of the research, seems to be that women can be both emotional AND logical at the same time, whereas if a man is experiencing emotions, logic goes out the window, but if he is being logical, he is suppressing his emotions. Back to the "more connections between left and right hemispheres in the female brain" thing. Men tend to compartmentalize more. Men also assume that if a woman is expressing emotions, she is being illogical, when in fact we're doing something semi-foreign to them, thinking and feeling at the same time.
I don't agree. I have seen far too many times, where a man immediately jumped to solve a problem with a violent temper tantrum (complete lack of emotional control) that I would have simply dealt with logically.
Oh, but anger doesn't count? Sorry. Yeah. It does.
The real difference, at least according to the beginnings of the research, seems to be that women can be both emotional AND logical at the same time, whereas if a man is experiencing emotions, logic goes out the window, but if he is being logical, he is suppressing his emotions. Back to the "more connections between left and right hemispheres in the female brain" thing. Men tend to compartmentalize more. Men also assume that if a woman is expressing emotions, she is being illogical, when in fact we're doing something semi-foreign to them, thinking and feeling at the same time.
Your views in general seem to be skewed by your past and how you perceived the males in your life at that time.
I'm not sure it's possible for you to separate things well enough to actually attempt and understanding from another side.
I never said males where void of emotion or emotional response.
If you get someone upset they will act upset, That's analogues between both sexes.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonic_Spork
I don't agree. I have seen far too many times, where a man immediately jumped to solve a problem with a violent temper tantrum (complete lack of emotional control) that I would have simply dealt with logically.
Oh, but anger doesn't count? Sorry. Yeah. It does.
The real difference, at least according to the beginnings of the research, seems to be that women can be both emotional AND logical at the same time, whereas if a man is experiencing emotions, logic goes out the window, but if he is being logical, he is suppressing his emotions. Back to the "more connections between left and right hemispheres in the female brain" thing. Men tend to compartmentalize more. Men also assume that if a woman is expressing emotions, she is being illogical, when in fact we're doing something semi-foreign to them, thinking and feeling at the same time.
Your views in general seem to be skewed by your past and how you perceived the males in your life at that time.
I'm not sure it's possible for you to separate things well enough to actually attempt and understanding from another side.
I never said males where void of emotion or emotional response.
If you get someone upset they will act upset, That's analogues between both sexes.
No, you said that men approach problems with logic, and women just react with emotion. Which I have found to be very untrue in many, many cases. I've seen men lose control over their emotions (often violently) and it wasn't just a man or two I've known in my life, it's been MANY men I've known. And I've seen women steel themselves to endure quietly, massive hardships and difficulties, and do what needs done, create plans of action and execute them methodically.
Some PEOPLE are more prone to lack of self control, and emotional outbursts, at some times or at all times, than others. But I don't believe for one moment that men have higher capacities for logical function overall, or that women are bundles of emotion or lack the ability to be logical.
I can only bear witness to the evidence of my own life...it may be anecdotal, but I have VOLUMES of anecdotes to draw from.
Plus, what about all the men who go completely escapist when problems arise? Are they handling their problems logically, when they choose to ignore them by getting drunk, doing drugs, or playing hours and hours of video games because they'd rather not confront something? That's not exercising logical problem solving, that's letting feelings of being overwhelmed and demotivated and unhappy about life drive you to stick your head in the sand. Happens to plenty of men. Plenty of women, too.
I'll give men credit for something though, when it's time for focus, I've seen men really shine. My ex and I often talked about how when it came to long range planning where one needed to spot all of the factors and work them into the equation, I was strongest. When there was a crisis and someone needed to spot the one thing to deal with FIRST among the dozen things clamoring for immediate attention that couldn't be done at the same time, he functioned better under that kind of pressure.
EDIT: Regarding, "if you get someone upset, they will act upset." Not me. I've got all the emotional repression of my almost entirely British ancestry in my toolkit. When I'm upset, I go silent and vanish. If I'm still talking, I'm not upset. I am not into emotional displays and public tantrums.
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