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Back to my statement about control NOT being love. How hard is that? That institutional Christianity has not followed what is inherent in the teachings OF Christianity is not a reflection on those teachings, ptsum, but on the hypocrisy of those who administered the religion and those who claimed to follow it.
Nate, the entire premise of Christianity IS control. You accept Jesus as your savior OR ELSE. The "or else" being hell. Forever. An eternity of agony.
There is zero way around that, not works, not giving, nothing. Every single person ever born is considered to be 100% incapable of being pure enough for God of his or her own accord and is therefore entirely dependant upon being saved via one specific person, Jesus. Without that complete submission, that person will be sent into eternal suffering.
Back to my statement about control NOT being love. How hard is that? That institutional Christianity has not followed what is inherent in the teachings OF Christianity is not a reflection on those teachings, ptsum, but on the hypocrisy of those who administered the religion and those who claimed to follow it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JerZ
Nate, the entire premise of Christianity IS control. You accept Jesus as your savior OR ELSE. The "or else" being hell. Forever. An eternity of agony.
There is zero way around that, not works, not giving, nothing. Every single person ever born is considered to be 100% incapable of being pure enough for God of his or her own accord and is therefore entirely dependant upon being saved via one specific person, Jesus. Without that complete submission, that person will be sent into eternal suffering.
How is that not control?
Nailed. Teachings or Institutional religion. Control. Slice it where you like; control.
''That's ok, we will have mercy on you and torture you until you do, if not, we will have pity on you and send you to the next world and perhaps your sacrifice will save you.''
Wow! Christians torture non-believers? I was a non-believer. No one ever tortured me or attempted to force me to believe. Please be careful with the hyperbole.
Hannibal was talking about what happened in the past -and that is hardly deniable.
Today, forced godliness is not so easy to get away with, though it was not so many decades ago that I was constantly having my arm twisted by churchmen to attend and get involved. By all accounts it was like that in the US until recently almost everywhere and it still is like that in many parts.
Control, control, control. Of course it is dressed up in the fluffy sheeps' clothing of God's love being extended to everyone that they can coerce into the church, because it's the best thing for them.
I still say that, if they had the control they would dearly love to have and are fighting for all the time, the fluffy fleece would not be so much in evidence.
Nate, the entire premise of Christianity IS control. You accept Jesus as your savior OR ELSE. The "or else" being hell. Forever. An eternity of agony.
There is zero way around that, not works, not giving, nothing. Every single person ever born is considered to be 100% incapable of being pure enough for God of his or her own accord and is therefore entirely dependant upon being saved via one specific person, Jesus. Without that complete submission, that person will be sent into eternal suffering.
How is that not control?
Wow! I was a non-believer for many years and no one ever tried to control me.
You have the freedom to believe anything you wish.
Hannibal was talking about what happened in the past -and that is hardly deniable.
Today, forced godliness is not so easy to get away with, though it was not so many decades ago that I was constantly having my arm twisted by churchmen to attend and get involved. By all accounts it was like that in the US until recently almost everywhere and it still is like that in many parts.
Control, control, control. Of course it is dressed up in the fluffy sheeps' clothing of God's love being extended to everyone that they can coerce into the church, because it's the best thing for them.
I still say that, if they had the control they would dearly love to have and are fighting for all the time, the fluffy fleece would not be so much in evidence.
"Paranoia strikes deep
Into your life it will creep."
Arequipa, I seriously doubt that you are so weak that any person approaching you asking you to attend a church, believe in God, or whatever, would have you trembling and knees knocking. Please tell me that I am not wrong.
Wow! I was a non-believer for many years and no one ever tried to control me.
You have the freedom to believe anything you wish.
Merry Christmas to you, JerZ.
If this were true, it is a new thing in the world, it was not true in the 20th century, but we will see about this century, but people are already being ruled, they just don't know it.
Freedom is only freedom to the majority rule, can one of these Atheists take their child to a public school in Texas with no fear that the school will teach his child about Christmas?
The Atheist is free to think as he wishes, but if he wants to be a citizen with rights to send his child to a public school, then he has agreed to turn his child over to people who teach his child what he should believe. The Atheist would get mad and pick his child up during the holidays, and then his child is segregated and looked at as an outcast from that time on.
Majority always rules, and what people are born into, they follow.
Last edited by Hannibal Flavius; 12-07-2014 at 05:24 PM..
IMO, the only reason Christianity is now swinging around to "it's all about love" is that force is no longer a commonly accepted way of making people see the light, so to speak, and therefore some new temptation is needed.
We have gotten more touchy-feely now, so now Christianity is trying to say that what's superior about it is that somehow their God is more loving than other gods/belief systems.
It's the simple evolution of religious marketing, IMO.
Then you are not familiar with what Jesus DID teach and how it was submerged in institutional religion and only observed by a small minority, the best example of which may be "St Francis of Assisi" who died in 1226. That Christianity has "swung" aroumd to "it's all about love" has largely been due to what we may call a cadre of activists for at least 400 years. Society "got touchy feely" largely because of spillover from that faith based initiative. You really should look at actual history.
Nate, the entire premise of Christianity IS control. You accept Jesus as your savior OR ELSE. The "or else" being hell. Forever. An eternity of agony.
There is zero way around that, not works, not giving, nothing. Every single person ever born is considered to be 100% incapable of being pure enough for God of his or her own accord and is therefore entirely dependant upon being saved via one specific person, Jesus. Without that complete submission, that person will be sent into eternal suffering.
How is that not control?
Oh it IS, and if that were what Jesus taught, you would have a point, but that is what institutional religion taught, not Jesus, and that was because the administers of institutional religion were ALL about control, the best example of which is John Calvin, who was so obsessed with it that he had God micromanaging EVERYthing.
Contrast that with faith groups that have been all about releasing people from bondage for the last 400 years or so based on what Jesus taught rather than what institutional Christianity taught. Do some real history instead of polemics.
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