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You are not going to understand spiritual things, being dead spiritually.
You cannot hear what a dog can hear , nor what a dog scan smell .
You cannot freeze and survive ,your blood will crystalize and die. But there are insects that can be frozen and survive.
there are special lenses that we can use to see certain color s in the spectrum, but with out them, we are blind to them. (infrared)
Your arrogance and rebellion will not allow God to intervene in your life ,you will never see the kingdom of God till it's too late.
That's your choice.
Jesus said God is spirit, and they that worship Him must worship Him in Spirit and in truth.
Jesus provided the Holy Spirit to teach and guide believers in God's will so they can be obedient to God.
God is not a task master , He guides those that love Him into blessing both others and as a result them self naturally.
Speaking in tongues is a exercise in obedience "IF" the person does not get hung up on the single event . Been there done that mentality.
It is not an end but a beginning in being taught what to say and when to shut up, just as God did with the prophets of the old testament.
Intercessory prayer often times employ both speaking as directed in the language I know, and speaking in a tongue not known to me yet .
I am agreeing with God / the Holy Spirit for the person/situation at hand.
Being immature spiritually, you cannot realize the warfare involved here, against the darkness of this world , never the less it exists .
Though naysayers scoff, they won't scoff long come judgment day.
Matthew 7;21,22,23, " Not every one that says to me, Lord, Lord, will enter the kingdom of heaven......................."
I wondered how many people have had experience of people speaking in so called 'tongues', or have actually indulged in it themselves?
It was a Sunday morning feature of my childhood. Two members of the congregation of the Elim Pentecostal church we attended, would suddenly feel impelled to spout gobbledegook, often during a prayer or the sermon! It was totally crazy and many of us tried to stifle giggles, including my mother.
As you would expect I am of the opinion that this nonsense is an aberration of the human brain and nothing to do with any deity, unless it enjoys watching people make total cretins of themselves. The notorious 'Toronto Blessing' where people actually barked liked dogs just goes to prove how totally idiotic this activity is.
The gibberish spoken by the Corinthians at Paul's time is not the same as what happened on Pentecost. The gibberish at best is a spiritual prayer.
From my personal experience, when a soul is speaking to another soul in the absence of the body, the listener will always hear his native tongue disregarding what language the speaker (even angels) chooses to speak (most likely his own native tongue). I suspect that the 'speaking in tongue' happened on Pentecost is closely related to this soul speaking mechanism.
The gibberish spoken by the Corinthians at Paul's time is not the same as what happened on Pentecost. The gibberish at best is a spiritual prayer.
From my personal experience, when a soul is speaking to another soul in the absence of the body, the listener will always hear his native tongue disregarding what language the speaker (even angels) chooses to speak (most likely his own native tongue). I suspect that the 'speaking in tongue' happened on Pentecost is closely related to this soul speaking mechanism.
Why are the magical explanations so popular in religions??? This is utter nonsense.
Paul practically calls it babbling. So I'm not sure what you mean.
Churches use the claim of a prayer language to explain their babbling. It is NOT the speaking in tongues mentioned in Scripture at all.
Paul knew that if a person spoke in a tongue and no one was there who spoke that language even that would be babbling to those around him. Speaking in tongues had a purpose to help those who spoke another language. The modern version is a hoax to draw people into a church and life style and keep the there.
Fascinating discussion. When I was a teen in the 1980s, I took a class called Power For Abundant Living, given by a group called The Way, founded by Dr. Victor Paul Weirwille. The class was a recording of the doctor as he gave the class some time in the 1960s. When I was watching the videos with a group of some 20 other people, the doctor had passed away a year or two before. He was a theologian who knew greek and Aramaic well enough to study the bible in their original, or as close to original as he could find, texts. His group stressed biblical study and accuracy, keeping what was being read in context. They explained speaking in tongues and interpreting in great detail, and most, if not all members were able to do it. After Dr. Weirwille's death, the group splintered, and is not what it was when he was alive. Anyway, at the end of the last videotape, everyone in the class was supposed to be able to speak in tongues. Everyone stood, and everyone except me was moved by the spirit and spoke in tongues. It was quite disappointing, and I blamed myself for not being good enough, or sorry enough for my sins. People sat with me and I tried over and over again, it never happened. I kinda got sour on religion after that, but I don't believe everyone in that room was delusional, or just putting on a show for me. There was nothing to gain from me, I had no money (In fact, people volunteered to drive me 20 or so miles twice a week for 6 weeks to attend this class). Why I can't seem to do it remains a mystery, but I won't let that discourage me from my beliefs. This class taught clear answers to many apparent biblical "contradictions". Since it was 29-30 years ago, I don't remember too much, so please don't press me on details. I've seen people speak in tongues, and I still believe that the people I saw were the real deal. That said, some of you bring up an interesting point, something I remember and can still hear in my mind to this day. One of the women, when she interpreted, always seemed to be saying the same thing, verbatim, each time, week after week. I always wondered why. Could it be fake? That's always a possibility. I'm always open for discussion on this, as long as it's civil. I realize many of you have much more experience in this than I do.
And YES, I am aware that The Way is very different now than it was when the founder was alive. It seems to be the natural progression of things. Starting out, the founder keeps things the way he intended it to be. Afterwards, others get involved, and ego gets in the way, and nothing is ever the same. Some people are good leaders, and most are not.
Why are the magical explanations so popular in religions??? This is utter nonsense.
That seems mostly to be what you share....about how God is imparting to you a special message and that the rest of us rubes are just unable to grasp it....
I dabbled in the experience of praying in tongues, privately, for a short period of time when I was a Christian. Looking back on it now, I think it was probably a form of meditation or self hypnosis, so not necessarily a bad thing. Never was something I would have wanted to do in a crowd, though, I must say.
I spoke in tongues every day for 30 years or so when I was a Pentecostal, but when I began looking back at Sinai and the prophesies of speaking in tongues, I decided I no longer believed in it, so after 30 years of speaking in tongues all day, I stopped.
I think you are right, it is a type of meditation to those who believe in it, if a person believes in something, it can actually help, it always helped me when I was angry because I expected it to. I don't think it's evil, I just don't think it is a gift of God.
The only foreign to guess I'm used to are those businesses I have to call and have no idea who is saying what. On the spiritual level no idea but don't think it's spiritual gift. The experience in Biblical times was referred to once and it was understood by many in their own language which meant no need for interpretation. Not proof you are saved. John 3:16 says it all and there are no therefore,although, also. Jesus did it all.
When God uttered his voice from mount Sinai, it was heard around the world, they actually saw the voice as it reverberated in the air, and everyone heard the voice in his own language.
God had warned the people that he would come and speak to them. A trumpet began sounding and it got louder, and louder, and louder, and this was a trumpet from heaven. God hovered over the people in a great fire, and he spoke to the people and they were terrified of it. They begged Moses not to ever let God speak to them again lest they die, and so on the day of Pentecost, instead of God speaking to the people, he spoke through the disciples so the people would not be terrified and every man heard in his own language. Instead of God hovering over the people in a fire, he hovered over the heads of the disciples in tongues of flames.
If somebody is speaking in tongues, it is a witness to the unbeliever that God is speaking through a disciple to the unbeliever using his own tongue. The person speaking does not speak the language he speaks, but the hearer hears in his own language. If somebody is truly speaking in tongues, then the reason is that God had put it in him because somebody of another tongue was present and understood.
Last edited by Hannibal Flavius; 12-26-2015 at 10:27 AM..
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