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This forum has to be one of the highest bleep-per-capita forums on planet earth. Does a body still exist if it is in a coma? Concepts don't exist? Are you people sane? Are you drunk?
Watching religious folks try to play philosophy is highly entertaining.
Best freaking post I have seen in a long time, yeah, I know he's talking about me but he's right, drunk as hell.
Well, not alcohol really, and it's really not drugs, it is spiritual food.
Little Peyote.
Let me show you what I really am.
Moderator cut: deleted
Last edited by june 7th; 06-13-2017 at 08:30 AM..
Reason: Inappropriate video.
This forum has to be one of the highest bleep-per-capita forums on planet earth. Does a body still exist if it is in a coma? Concepts don't exist? Are you people sane? Are you drunk?
Watching religious folks try to play philosophy is highly entertaining.
Why can't one be religious and a philosopher? It is a fine line that separates the two.
I doubt people exist pretty frequently. Unfortunately it is very difficult to prove/disprove existence.
Existence is consciousness. You can not demonstrate anything exists; but you know something must exist by acknowledging it.
Personally I'm pretty sure this is all a simulation.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wittgenstein's Ghost
This forum has to be one of the highest bleep-per-capita forums on planet earth. Does a body still exist if it is in a coma? Concepts don't exist? Are you people sane? Are you drunk?
Watching religious folks try to play philosophy is highly entertaining.
Because it goes over your head or you do not enjoy it does not make it invalid philosophical questions. It certainly doesn't mean the answer will be terribly useful, but it's not harmful to anyone to ponder it and it can lead to interesting conversations. If this isn't your cup of tea, go somewhere else.
This forum has to be one of the highest bleep-per-capita forums on planet earth. Does a body still exist if it is in a coma? Concepts don't exist? Are you people sane? Are you drunk?
Watching religious folks try to play philosophy is highly entertaining.
Presumably you are not speaking about "religious folks" like William Lane Craig, Alvin Plantinga, John Haldane, J. P. Moreland and Peter van Inwagen, all of whom conned their way onto the list of the 50 Most Influential Living Philosophers, https://thebestschools.org/features/...-philosophers/?
A frequent ploy in the philosophical literature is to dismiss a critic as "not a professional philosopher." A lawyer may play the same game, particularly when a non-lawyer makes a point that stumps him. Is it your position that ontology is exclusively the purview of professional philosophers?
And your credentials as a professional philosopher are? The name Wittgenstein's Ghost does not, I regret to inform you, carry with it Wittgenstein's academic and professional credentials.
I think our lives have already been planned out and there is no free will, and we are like holographs that play in some theater in another universe, I don't know. I just really don't believe I can change anything whether good or bad. They started building some billion dollar machine a decade ago or so, and it was to prove whether we existed or not. I never heard what became of it, but the people building it believe about like I believe.
That we are not even real.
I would inquire as to your reasons for believing all of the above, but I fear you will tell us.
I would inquire as to your reasons for believing all of the above, but I fear you will tell us.
All those people in the bible had to be named exactly what they were named. Everyone in the bible had a role to play out exactly as it did and it could not have possibly been different, their lives were planned before they were born.
All those people in the bible had to be named exactly what they were named. Everyone in the bible had a role to play out exactly as it did and it could not have possibly been different, their lives were planned before they were born.
My fear was ungrounded. Apparently you have no particular reasons for believing what you do.
My fear was ungrounded. Apparently you have no particular reasons for believing what you do.
I have found no reason yet to believe we have free will. Furthermore I don't think a lack of free will has to be proven (in the same way a lack of god doesn't need to be proven). Rather I think free will need be proven as it has no explanation unless you subscribe to religion and can explain it with a soul.
I have found no reason yet to believe we have free will. Furthermore I don't think a lack of free will has to be proven (in the same way a lack of god doesn't need to be proven). Rather I think free will need be proven as it has no explanation unless you subscribe to religion and can explain it with a soul.
Before I subscribe to either point of view, I would very much require proof. Declaring that one side needs to be proven makes the other the default position, and neither actually is.
Yours is the solution which comes from "I don't want to think about it, so I will simply make a declaration in the absence of evidence."
Before I subscribe to either point of view, I would very much require proof. Declaring that one side needs to be proven makes the other the default position, and neither actually is.
Yours is the solution which comes from "I don't want to think about it, so I will simply make a declaration in the absence of evidence."
I think this is the kneejerk reaction to someone saying you don't have free will. So let's have a think and figure out if there is a default position.
What is free will? What does someone mean when they say that they have free will?
They mean that out of all possible choices at any given moment they are free to choose any of those choices and if given another chance they could have chose another one. This is the idea the justice system is built on. Imagine someone comes over and spits on you. You're probably mad at them. Why? Because in your mind under the assumption of free will, they could have chosen not to do that, but instead they did it. This justifies your anger with them.
So just what is required for free will? It requires that you are the originator of all of your "conscious" decisions. At a physical level you, the spirit or consciousness, must have commanded the particle or atom that went on to become your choice. We have no reason to believe any such entity exists and we have no science to explain its existence. We do, however have science that can tell us how particles behave.
I think it is fair to say that the default position should in fact be that free will is an illusion as science requires no free will nor suggests that any free will exists. To argue that free will does exist, you must explain how you the "spirit" or you the "soul" or you the "consciousness" is free to disobey the laws of physics in order to be free to make "any" choice. Until such time you must accept that choices are either the product of a deterministic physical system in which, as Hannibal said, your entire life is pretty much planned out or that they're the product of some quantum model in which case they are random and you the "conscious entity" are still not in control.
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