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What if everyone is partially right and the universal collective consciousness leads to God? And everyone is put into the world for a reason, and each religion has a reason?
Humans are evolving, our knowledge are abilities are increasing, our lifespans are increasing, the world population is rapidly growing. Maybe those are mostly because of science, but science is yet to prove one very important thing. And if there is a God what sort of creator would not want to see all of his children grow and mature. And as humans are growing our beliefs and our religions mature.
It may seem like a lot of fluff especially to those who are certain their religion is the right and only one, but I was just wondering what if.
Regarding this Jazz of "what sort of creature would not want his children to grow and mature".
Here is my opinion which is in three parts provided that we are assuming that there is a God out there and there is heaven and hell.
1 - If God wanted that, he would have simply created humans and entered them in Paradise. There was no point of sending them to this world with a given mortal life and certain time limit.
Why did God do what he did and gave us intelligence and ability to choose? Because, he is God and he can and he will do whatever he wants to do.
He is not answerable to anyone and there is no one that could stop him.
Perhaps the actual and more logical thing to worry about now is, "We are here, so lets deal with it".
2 - Why would you expect God to do it all for you? Why don't you think that, what sort of human would NOT want to grow and mature and enter paradise, and avoid going to hell?
The onus is NOT on God, the onus is on each human as to what route he wants to take?
Does he want to follow the red line or the green line? It's a choice that we can make while the clock keeps clicking.
Otherwise, there is no point in life and intelligence given to us. God would have simply put us all in heaven. Read point 1 again.
So yes, God DOES want you to grow and mature, that's why he gave you life and intelligence. The question now is, do YOU want to grow and mature, and make the best use of what's been given to you?
3 - Regarding all religions and all people.
I think except for Islam, almost all religions have one common theme.
"You accept our religion and you are guaranteed a no question asked, placed in heaven."
Again, defeats the point of life given to us. Why?
There is a pretty simple straight logical counter argument to this. If a religion guarantees a "no question asked place in heaven" then it's followers should immediately commit suicide. Why live in this challenging world anymore? Why pay bills and taxes and rents and mortgages?
You may come back with the argument and say that I don't want to leave my dog alone on the earth, so I prefer living with my dog rather than going to heaven.
The answer is, theoretically heaven is a bliss, you would not have ANY worry whatsoever. Whether you left a dog or a huge real estate behind, it won't bother you.
1 - If God wanted that, he would have simply created humans and entered them in Paradise. There was no point of sending them to this world with a given mortal life and certain time limit.
Why did God do what he did and gave us intelligence and ability to choose? Because, he is God and he can and he will do whatever he wants to do.
He is not answerable to anyone and there is no one that could stop him.
When individuals know the answer to "why" aren't they playing God?
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoCardinals
3 - Regarding all religions and all people.
I think except for Islam, almost all religions have one common theme.
"You accept our religion and you are guaranteed a no question asked, placed in heaven."
I think this is off. I believe a lot of religions and spiritual teachers take a more agnostic approach to afterlife. Far more so than Christianity where heaven and hell is clear cut - one of my biggest issues with the religion. Anyone who knows a lot about religious afterlife beliefs want to clear things up?
God has no purpose for religions which He never authored , which is the hard truth , as God condemned Israel in the bible for going after strange religions and sent a whole generation into the hand of their enemies for 70 years because they followed other strange gods ..... See God is Sovereign King , and who are people to question His ideas , either people are in or out of the plan of God
It seems to me that, inherently, no one and no thing, including science, will ever prove an unfalsifiable hypothesis.
That does not make such a hypothesis worthy of belief however.
As to the question of beliefs maturing, I'm not so sure. To borrow a metaphor from Stranger Things, in many respects we live in the "upside down" these days, in which an astounding number of people feel entitled not only to their own beliefs, but to their own facts. I want to believe that humanity is gaining ground overall, but it's difficult to feel or even see that at the moment.
Can religions mature? In theory, yes, and in practice, to a limited extent, they do. I think for example that some liberal Christian and post-Christian denominations have evolved their beliefs in ways that are more compatible with intellectual honesty -- or as a wag might say, less incompatible.
some people don't understand forming an hypothesis off of data and others don't care about the truth so long as their deny anything holds up. science is driven by taking small steps to prove the improvable.
but hey, when we are forming up with a belief statement (t-shirt colors) about anti religion, why would we even care about such nonsense.
some people don't understand forming an hypothesis off of data and others don't care about the truth so long as their deny anything holds up. science is driven by taking small steps to prove the improvable.
but hey, when we are forming up with a belief statement (t-shirt colors) about anti religion, why would we even care about such nonsense.
One of the reasons for the post was to try to get people to thing about things from a different, more open minded view. Tough for a lot of people on here to do. I figured it would fail miserably which it did
What if everyone is partially right and the universal collective consciousness leads to God? And everyone is put into the world for a reason, and each religion has a reason?
Humans are evolving, our knowledge are abilities are increasing, our lifespans are increasing, the world population is rapidly growing. Maybe those are mostly because of science, but science is yet to prove one very important thing. And if there is a God what sort of creator would not want to see all of his children grow and mature. And as humans are growing our beliefs and our religions mature.
It may seem like a lot of fluff especially to those who are certain their religion is the right and only one, but I was just wondering what if.
Yeah, well my position is that stuff probably is not true, and it should not be proclaimed as true unless there is evidence to support it. So until there is good evidence for a god, or Satan, or ghosts, or that crystal balls foretell the future, I'll remain skeptical.
If a religion guarantees a "no question asked place in heaven" then it's followers should immediately commit suicide. Why live in this challenging world anymore? Why pay bills and taxes and rents and mortgages?
For once we agree.
The more typical Christian riposte to this idea is not about pets, but about it being god's will that we experience this life as a sort of moral training-ground. Also, that god alone has the right to determine when your life ends, presumably via natural means as it's too much trouble to simply send a lightning bolt to vaporize each person at the appropriate time. (See your argument #1 for why god requires us to live this life regardless of how much sense it does(n't) make: because God CAN).
You're right, though, heaven creates a problem for Christianity which is why they had to gin up the taboo against suicide. They did it precisely BECAUSE too many people were taking up your hypothetical advice and offing themselves. Unchecked, it would have turned the whole of Christianity into a suicide cult.
When individuals know the answer to "why" aren't they playing God?
I think this is off. I believe a lot of religions and spiritual teachers take a more agnostic approach to afterlife. Far more so than Christianity where heaven and hell is clear cut - one of my biggest issues with the religion. Anyone who knows a lot about religious afterlife beliefs want to clear things up?
Heaven and hell is not "clear cut" across the variations of Christianity, nor does every Christian tradition believe they are the only true spiritual path.
Well, this gets us nowhere. cardinals admits that his argument only even looks like one IF you assume a god at the outset. If you don't then the reasons why it doesn't make sense inot because it makes sense to God, if not to us, but It doesn't make sense.
That really does it, folks. The other posts are more for theists of various kinds to scatch their heands and argue about. It hardly concerns atheists at all.
It's like the 'Which God?" claim. Once you all decide and agree which religion is the right one, then you can come and talk to us.
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What's your definition of God? I ask this because the universal collective consciousness includes everyone; from Mother Teresa to Adolf Hitler.
