Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
My thought is no. If someone has never heard of a religion, reading scripture of that religion won't convert them. It's only when someone is influenced by others, that the scripture takes on meaning.
I think what draws us to and away from religion comes down to our psychological make up and a large part of that comes from positive and negative influences from childhood.
A certain amount of base knowledge is required. If one doesn't know what the Scriptures are, it's unlikely that they'll put a lot of weight on them. But God can and does use whatever means he wishes. Even in the NT book of Acts, we read that the apostles didn't simply drop off letters explaining who Jesus is, and watch people convert. They actually spoke to people about Jesus.
Not all Christians are condemning. Even most fundamentalists aren't.
But all evangelicals are nothing but pure condemnation. In fact, that is all that comprises them. Condemnation is their only attribute.
I don't think that you get my point. The doctrine is that those who do not believe in Jesus Christ as their Lord and sviour are going to go to Hell. This is condemnation as a dogma, no matter what individuals think of the condemned or how they act towards them.
Now I agree (1) that UR Christians don't do this, though that raises a woile nest of other problems, or opens a new can of worms. But the fact is that I know of no Church dogma that teaches other than unbelievers or Wrong believers are condemned by Dogma to some version of hell or some threat that is intended to frighten the bums onto the seats.
I can't recall whether it's an Arq Atheist Axiom or a Transdictum (there's an atheist religion -term, if I ever heard one) but maybe it should be one: "Decent religious people are decent in spite of their religion, not because of it".
(1) with the hypothetical poster who may raise the point in mind here. I know the poster didn't. This is what is called 'Thinking ahead" and it is often a profound irritation when, after having anticipated and disposed of that possible objection, poster protests "Where did I say that?".
Last edited by TRANSPONDER; 11-28-2017 at 11:17 AM..
It’s only when someone is influenced by the Holy Spirit that the scripture comes to life.
John 6:24
"No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him; and I will raise him up on the last day.” -Jesus
Quote:
Originally Posted by zthatzmanz28
But you say we need the bible to understand Jesus and the Holy Spirit..that without the bible we are doomed and only the bible can give us understanding so why do we need the Holy Spirit?
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmiej
I said you would know nothing about Jesus without scripture.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BaptistFundie
A certain amount of base knowledge is required. If one doesn't know what the Scriptures are, it's unlikely that they'll put a lot of weight on them. But God can and does use whatever means he wishes. Even in the NT book of Acts, we read that the apostles didn't simply drop off letters explaining who Jesus is, and watch people convert. They actually spoke to people about Jesus.
This seems to point up what Jimmie was getting at rather well.
While from the Believer point of view the explanation shows how the Revelation of True Belief comes about, I am of course going to see it as how the swindle , scam and con -trick works.
First, of course the doctrine as set out in...well, let's say whichever ghost bible the belief- organization uses...words, with appropriate scripture to back it up. The Word as per scripture definitely comes first. I know there are those who may be converted without going near a Bible, but I'm thinking of the process of coming to Jesus the hard way.
So you are given the Dogma and the proofs from the Bible backed up with support from Science, history or respected authorities as required. THEN, if this does not persuade, the appeal is made brainwash yourself, let Jesus into your heart and then the Holy Spirit will make all the contents of the Scriptures clear to you.
Not, apparently, to others on the boards who have has Different interpretations revealed to them, however.
The One Shot Win, eh, Jimmie? pock up on one piffling and pretty irrelevant point you think you can make stick, and if you can win that one, you can tell yourself that you must be right about everything else, too.
A certain amount of base knowledge is required. If one doesn't know what the Scriptures are, it's unlikely that they'll put a lot of weight on them.
There are some believers (probably not you, if I don't miss my guess) who treat the scriptures like a magic talisman, sort of like how a Catholic exorcist puts the Bible against a possessed person to burn the demons out. Mostly holiness tradition folks I would guess. They would take the passages that talk about the "power of the Word" literally. They would imagine that simply marinading a person in Bible verses would, all by itself, eventually convert them.
I appreciate that you have a more intelligent approach than that. But it should be pointed out that this magical belief that the Bible has some inherent power -- or at least that the content of the Bible does -- is not unknown among us.
There are some believers (probably not you, if I don't miss my guess) who treat the scriptures like a magic talisman, sort of like how a Catholic exorcist puts the Bible against a possessed person to burn the demons out. Mostly holiness tradition folks I would guess. They would take the passages that talk about the "power of the Word" literally. They would imagine that simply marinading a person in Bible verses would, all by itself, eventually convert them.
I appreciate that you have a more intelligent approach than that. But it should be pointed out that this magical belief that the Bible has some inherent power -- or at least that the content of the Bible does -- is not unknown among us.
Rather more, I think BF has it back to front. Putting credibility in the scriptures requires a considerable ignorance of what they are. The more you come to understand them and their history, the less one will credit that. Just look at the absurd KJV cult. Ok so like the compilation of the various scriptures into the Constantinian Bible, the publication of the first translations of the Latin into the vernacular, the first printed English Bible, the Translation authorized by James 1st is a significant event in the evolution of the Bible. But to regard it as the only correct word of God is simply absurd.
I can still remember the jaw -dropping sight of smiling Christians burning BIBLES..because they weren't KJV.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
pock up on one piffling and pretty irrelevant point you think you can make stick, and if you can win that one, you can tell yourself that you must be right about everything else, too.
