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And yet, these same 5 items convinced me to be an atheist. I would have to rephrase them a bit.
1. The lack of historical evidence for either the existence of christ, and the historical errors made by the bible.
2. Evidence that prayer does not work.
3. Meeting christians who seem to be greedy, grasping and selfish.
4. Evidence that fossil records, and many other things, conclusively prove evolution.
5. Lots of biblical contradictions.
1. I believe a man called Jesus who proclaimed to be the son of God existed. I know he wasn't . And I agree the bible has many historical errors. Just too many errors and outlandish tales in general.
2. Agreed. But I'm speaking of personal experience.
3. Agreed. But I've met some very good and sincere ones too. My mom for example .
4. Exactly. 'nuff said!
5. I again concur wholeheartedly. The book contradicts itself from begining to end.
Wow! I didn't expect so many responses. Thank you!
To answer Matt who asked:
Are you bothered that agnostics or atheists come to this board? If your faith is so strong you shouldn't have a problem with dissenting opinions, in fact you should welcome them! Isn't it your duty as a christian to try to put these nonbelievers back onto the path of salvation? Or is this board just a pep rally?[/quote]
No, I'm not bothered at all. I was just curious and frankly surprised to see how many were posting. I have no problem with other's opinions. I am thankful I live in America where we have this kind of freedom. I can't put anyone on the path of salvation - that's the Holy Spirit's job. If He chooses to use something I say - fine, but it will only be because His Spirit draws a person to God - not because of me.
Actually, a pep rally isn't a bad idea. There's nothing like sharing our love and praises in concert with other believers. It strengthens and encourages us. It brings me joy to delight in my Lord.
I was baptised into the Methodist faith at a young impressionable age, went to many different church services and faiths sporadically while growing up (actually while growing older, I'm determined not to grow up) that did little for me spiritually; Married in a Pentocostal church, and at the young age of 50, finally find the niche for me....spiritually.... and She and I serve each other well.
I think as long as one is true to whatever faith and or spiritual format they chose for themselves and are not denegrating to those who chose a different way, can be civil and respectful of the multitude of beliefs out here then there is a place here for all who chose to expound, seek knowledge and clarification, and share their personal belief systems.
I think as long as one is... not denegrating to those who chose a different way, [we] can be civil and respectful of the multitude of beliefs out here.
And herein lies the secret. When many belief systems often, in their dogma, condemn certain other faiths (Paul in Romans I, for example, and his strongly negative view of the religions Paul calls, collectively, "idolatry") in such a resounding way, it is often hard, I think, for many people of faith to balance the "truth" of this religious foundation with the reality of our multicultural, multi-faithful society -- but perhaps this is a topic for another thread...
a religion forum is a place for people to discuss religious views. even though an athiest doesn't believe in religion, he/she still has religious views.
Well, no one can argue about your personal experiences. But please expound on #4, please.
Sorry for not responding earlier, but to quickly answer your question,
"If slow, gradual evolution occurred, you would expect to observe a continuum of change in the fossil record. After all, if life took millions of years to arrive at its' present state of development, the earth should be filled with fossils that could be easily assembled into a number of series showing minor changes as species were evolving.
The opposite is true - no continuum! When fossils are examined they form records of existing and extinct organisms with clearly defined gaps, or missing transitional forms, consistent with a creationist's view of origins." - quoted from: http://emporium.turnpike.net/C/cs/fossils.htm
I also read "The Case for Creation" by Lee Strobel which makes the same argument and goes deeper, but I felt this was the strongest point in the evolution debate.
Many Atheist's have converted to Christianity, while attempting to disprove it. Such as myself, C.S Lewis, Lee Strobel, Josh McDowell, and many many others. So I say to all Atheist's, Agnostic's, and people from other faith's, investigate it for yourselves. Try to disprove it. Don't take my word or anybody else's word for it. I dare you.
Many Atheist's have converted to Christianity, while attempting to disprove it. Such as myself, C.S Lewis, Lee Strobel, Josh McDowell, and many many others. So I say to all Atheist's, Agnostic's, and people from other faith's, investigate it for yourselves. Try to disprove it. Don't take my word or anybody else's word for it. I dare you.
You can't disprove faith....that is why it's 'faith' and not 'fact. Faith doesnt' need to be proved or disproved.
Some former Atheists do discover they have faith, but just as many former Christians and others who thought they had faith discover they prefer rational thought.
It's a two way street you are telling people to go down.
Sorry for not responding earlier, but to quickly answer your question,
"If slow, gradual evolution occurred, you would expect to observe a continuum of change in the fossil record. After all, if life took millions of years to arrive at its' present state of development, the earth should be filled with fossils that could be easily assembled into a number of series showing minor changes as species were evolving.
The opposite is true - no continuum! When fossils are examined they form records of existing and extinct organisms with clearly defined gaps, or missing transitional forms, consistent with a creationist's view of origins." - quoted from: http://emporium.turnpike.net/C/cs/fossils.htm
I also read "The Case for Creation" by Lee Strobel which makes the same argument and goes deeper, but I felt this was the strongest point in the evolution debate.
I think one of the most frustrating things for an evolutionist or atheist to explain is the fossil record. Because creationists want a steady continuum they do not understand the concept of MILLIONS AND BILLIONS of years. I normally do not like to compare inanimate objects to living organisms but it is the only comparison I can think of. If I were to set a glass of water on my kitchen counter, what record do you think there will be of it 1 year from now? 100 years from now? 1000 years from now? Do you see what I am getting at? Over time, someone will probably knock the glass over and it will shatter into a million pieces. They will sweep it up and throw it away in the trash. The garbage man will take the trash to a garbage dump and throw it in a big pile. After that, it may be burned, crushed even further, or saturated in mud. The chance 1 million years from now of even finding a fragment of that glass that came from a "set" i bought in a store are slim to none. The chance that we find fossils even now requires the perfect conditions to be met so that whatever is fossilized has remained fossilized.
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love........it's for every body
Seek and you will find
