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I think this topic has nothing to do with religion but more to do with secular culture and getting the two of those intermingled is a very dangerous thing.
I'm not quite sure what you're getting at but I think that secular culture with it's ever changing styles and trends is always going to influence everyone in society to a certain extent including those who are religious. Religious institutions by their nature tend to be rather conservative and that's probably the reason this question came up in the first place. This topic is religious in the sense that we're discussing the religious setting of a church and how the members of that church might react to the appearance of individuals with body piercings or tatoos and also how the individuals who have them might feel about being in a church. Religion and secular culture are always intermingled because the congregation of any church is just a representation of the secular society that they're a part of. Maybe you could elaborate on why you think that's dangerous.
Well for me personally I believe the body is a temple and we should not defile it. We are God's creatures and I don't think its appropriate to "mark up" His creations.
Well, that's your PERSONAL opinion, since there really isn't anything specifically about it in the Bible... but that still doesn't answer the question presented earlier, about whether one shouldn't be able to "walk the path" if they're modified. Tattoos are permanent, so it seems a bit shallow and unreasonable to say tattooed people shouldn't be going to church - not that you said that exactly, but you are implying it. So unless you think we should scrape them off & "defile" our body even further, you'll have to put up with seeing our colorful skin at church/synagogue.
I believe the body is a temple and we should not defile it.
Let me interject a little humour to lighten the mood a little bit. When I was twenty I suppose I could have considered my body as a temple. When I was thirty my body was much like a three bedroom home with two baths. At fourty my body had gone downhill and had much more in common with a double wide mobile home. At fifty my body was very similar to a run down one bedroom apartment on the wrong side of the tracks. In two years I'll be sixty and a common outhouse might give my body a run for its money. I don't want to think beyond that.
I think it doesn't matter to me what they have on them, in them, or over them...they're in church, and there's A LOT of other places they could be. Not for me to judge.
Let me interject a little humour to lighten the mood a little bit. When I was twenty I suppose I could have considered my body as a temple. When I was thirty my body was much like a three bedroom home with two baths. At fourty my body had gone downhill and had much more in common with a double wide mobile home. At fifty my body was very similar to a run down one bedroom apartment on the wrong side of the tracks. In two years I'll be sixty and a common outhouse might give my body a run for its money. I don't want to think beyond that.
LOL! This is too true!...Sad but true.
I'm sure you are much more like a finely aged cheese....a little stinky but with way more flavor!
I have a tattoo (head of a black panther) on the left side of my chest that I got as a birthday gift from my soon-to-be wife. Yes, we were (are) both fairly conservative Christians, but I didn't come across anything in my reading of the Bible (at that time) to say if it was bad or not.
Then I read the passage that's been quoted here, about not defiling our bodies, and I FREAKED !! I was soooo upset. Now, my wife has two and I have the one and you can't see them unless we want you to And believe me, I kept them secret from our church --- until we got baptized. Hello, anyone want to see a tattoo from a recently baptized person?! It showed right through my nice, white, soaking wet T-shirt!!
Well, no one in our church made any stink about it. Then, just about a year ago, I noticed our senior pastor (about 45-50 yr old) had gotten one of those bracelet kind that goes all around his wrist -- with biblical passages!! So from then on I've felt more comfortable with my tattoo. I don't annouce it, but I don't hide the fact it exists. I figured, someone with his biblical knowledge would know if it was right or wrong, right? (Hope so )
I do my very best not to judge anyone based on appearance, and same with my church. We are a 'come as you are' kinda place. The pastor even preaches in jeans. But you have to admit, there are some visible tattoos that raise eyebrows and you kind of say to yourself, "What kind of individual would choose that tattoo?" I talk with them and find out for myself what kind of person they are.
As an aside, my cousin who went through 2 tours in Iraq had a tattoo on his forearm that read "Jesus Christ Is Lord" --- in Arabic !!
NOTE: This is my first post in a while (things are better ) -- sorry so long
I'm not quite sure what you're getting at but I think that secular culture with it's ever changing styles and trends is always going to influence everyone in society to a certain extent including those who are religious. Religious institutions by their nature tend to be rather conservative and that's probably the reason this question came up in the first place. This topic is religious in the sense that we're discussing the religious setting of a church and how the members of that church might react to the appearance of individuals with body piercings or tatoos and also how the individuals who have them might feel about being in a church. Religion and secular culture are always intermingled because the congregation of any church is just a representation of the secular society that they're a part of. Maybe you could elaborate on why you think that's dangerous.
Sure. I agree that secular culture influences everyone, include those religious. What I meant as being dangerous is when a popular idea is taken (often by a group of people, religious conservative for instance) and a positive or negative stance is taken and promoted on it when, in fact, the Bible doesn't speak on it one way or the other.
I think in this case that "defile" is a subjective term. People don't get tattoos to purposely give themselves pain or make themselves ugly. They do it (most of the time) because the tattoo is symbolic of something that is very important in their lives. Is it defiling the body to have a very well-drawn cross on my chest across my heart because I have love in my heart for God? I just don't understand how some people can be supportive of plastic surgery, or ear piercing or permanent makeup or sun tanning and yet be so adamantly against tattoos. All of these things "mark the body" and could qualify as "defilement" by someone's definition.
I think in this case that "defile" is a subjective term. People don't get tattoos to purposely give themselves pain or make themselves ugly. They do it (most of the time) because the tattoo is symbolic of something that is very important in their lives. Is it defiling the body to have a very well-drawn cross on my chest across my heart because I have love in my heart for God? I just don't understand how some people can be supportive of plastic surgery, or ear piercing or permanent makeup or sun tanning and yet be so adamantly against tattoos. All of these things "mark the body" and could qualify as "defilement" by someone's definition.
I'll give you an AMEN for that! I totally agree, that "defile" is a very subjective term... and a highly offensive one at that, so I do find the use of it (on this thread) to be quite rude. And I'd like a raise of hands - who here has pierced ears?? If you raised your hand, you too are guilty of "defiling" your body. Somebody here said "at least you can remove an earring", but that hole or scar will always be there... I removed my tongue piercing 9 years ago, and still have a visible and slightly opened hole. Anyway, good post Jzer!
P.S. You're also right about the significance of tattoos, which range from a simple "it makes me happy", to very deep cultural and spiritual meanings. Mine ALL have a story behind them, which I'm happy to tell if somebody asks politely.
I'll give you an AMEN for that! I totally agree, that "defile" is a very subjective term... and a highly offensive one at that, so I do find the use of it (on this thread) to be quite rude. And I'd like a raise of hands - who here has pierced ears?? If you raised your hand, you too are guilty of "defiling" your body. Somebody here said "at least you can remove an earring", but that hole or scar will always be there... I removed my tongue piercing 9 years ago, and still have a visible and slightly opened hole. Anyway, good post Jzer!
P.S. You're also right about the significance of tattoos, which range from a simple "it makes me happy", to very deep cultural and spiritual meanings. Mine ALL have a story behind them, which I'm happy to tell if somebody takes the time to ask politely.
I was just thinking about the peirced ears thing too! Also if I had the tummy I would totally want a belly ring...I think they are really pretty. Hmmmm, brings me back to the thought of the tummy moral...LOL I think most people who alter their bodies are adorning them not defiling them, as I said earlier beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I really wanted to get a small celtic design tattoo, but with my sensitive skin and low tolerance to pain...I am not a good candidate at all!
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My thoughts ...
!! I was soooo upset. Now, my wife has two and I have the one and you can't see them unless we want you to 
)
And I'd like a raise of hands - who here has pierced ears?? If you raised your hand, you too are guilty of "defiling" your body. Somebody here said "at least you can remove an earring", but that hole or scar will always be there... I removed my tongue piercing 9 years ago, and still have a visible and slightly opened hole. Anyway, good post Jzer!
