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A lease is a contract obligation, if by third party your referring to an executor, the Delaware state law alone is proof this isn't true.
There are no statutes for PA on termination after death, the lease must provide this clause.
The only reason for breach of contract other than , section8 housing, military, is domestic violence, that was updated in an earlier post.
If you can provide links to prove this wrong , feel free.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdm2008
Actually no you are incorrect. You cannot relegate contract obligations to third parties without their consent. Period. Your quote is not contract law it is simply a clause stated somewhere which have conveniently neglected to cite. Do you know what contract law is?
Section 250.303. Collection of rent in special cases
(a) The following persons shall have the right to collect all rent due by
assumpsit or by distraint on personal property located on the real property subject to such rent:
(1) The owner of a ground rent;
(2) The personal representative of a deceased landlord or deceased tenant for life who has demised the real property subject to his estate, or a deceased landlord whose real property has escheated to the Commonwealth, whether such rent accrued prior to or after the death of the decedent and until the termination of the administration of the estate;
(3) The escheator appointed for the purpose of collecting rents;
(4) The spouse of a deceased landlord to whom real property has been set
aside at his or her allowance by law; and,
(5) A widow who is the party named in a deed, agreement or decree of court
under which a charge is made upon such real estate for the payment of installments of dower.
(b) Any person given the right by this section to collect and distrain for rent shallbe deemed for the purposes of this article to be a landlord.
Quote:
Originally Posted by virgode
A lease is a contract obligation, if by third party your referring to an executor, the Delaware state law alone is proof this isn't true.
There are no statutes for PA on termination after death, the lease must provide this clause.
The only reason for breach of contract other than , section8 housing, military, is domestic violence, that was updated in an earlier post.
If you can provide links to prove this wrong , feel free.
Incorrect. The lease probably and not unusually has a stipulation that the terms of the lease have a contingency clause which passes the debts and encumbrances onto the heirs or consignees. In fact the LL in this case could require rental payments until the end of the lease period if he wasn't able to mitigate his losses. The fact that the LL has only required one month's final rent is neither unusual nor illegal and more than fair.
STT, normally you're a great poster but sorry man, you're way wrong on this one. Just like NEOhioBound stated...
Quote:
Originally Posted by NEOhioBound
STT- where was this so called clause you keep bringing up?? How do you know it was in the lease the deceased woman signed? Even if it was, IT isn't LEGAL. You can not enforce a single person to make payment on a debt that is not theres by signature. The only person the LL can LEGALLY obtain money from is from the Estate of the dead woman. End of story
Exactly correct. Even if it was in the lease, it's not legal. It violates even the most basic principles of contract law. The apartment complex cannot impute responsibility on a 3rd party without the 3rd party's consent.
In no way, shape, or form would this ever fly in court. Like you, NEOhio, I can list more than a few sleazy debt collectors who found this out the hard way.
Quote:
If someone who passes away holds a bank note for a car or a mortgage on a property or credit card debts, does the bank just say, "no worries, we'll just write it off?"
No. They can repossess the collateral (vehicle) and/or try to get payment out of the estate, but if there is no or insufficient estate to cover the debts they have no legal recourse to recoup their money. Sure, some of the sleazy ones will try to trick and intimidate family members into paying the debts, but they are under zero legal obligation to do so. Some of the uneducated masses will fall for this trick, but people like myself and apparently NEOhio are pretty quick to hand out attitude adjustments via the courts.
Hopefully some lawyer (maybe from the NACA) steps up and takes this guy's case for free or cheap and hits this apartment complex in the pocketbooks for their stupidity.
There is no statute on terminating the lease for death.
That statute tells uswho can collect or pay rent, the representative or executor, nothing more.
The reasons for breach according to PA state law were posted, it doesn't include termination after death, the lease must include a death clause.
The lease doesn't need a death clause because when signer dies, the lease basically dies with the signer. By your theory, the apartment complex did not cover themselves by not having a death clause in place- which wouldn't have mattered anyway since it has been pointed out, repeatedly, that PA TENANT LAWS state that rent payment if any will be addressed by the Estate.
Seriously, it is like http://www.advantagecontent.com/images/beat-dead-horse.gif (broken link) in this thread
Section 250.303. Collection of rent in special cases
(a) The following persons shall have the right to collect all rent due by
assumpsit or by distraint on personal property located on the real property subject to such rent:
(1) The owner of a ground rent;
(2) The personal representative of a deceased landlord or deceased tenant for life who has demised the real property subject to his estate, or a deceased landlord whose real property has escheated to the Commonwealth, whether such rent accrued prior to or after the death of the decedent and until the termination of the administration of the estate;
.
NROhio is right, the lease does not survice the tenant's death so no personal liability for the son.
Additionally, the PA statute above doesnt even give the landlord in the York, PA case the right to collect additional rent from the estate for any period after the son moved mom's things out and gave keys back to the landlord.
Section (2) allows the following to collect:
1. Personal rep of a deceased landlord
2. Personal rep of a deceased tenant for life , who has rented the property to someone else.
There is no indication from the story in York, PA that the landlord died, or that the mom held the property by a life tenancy but let someone else live there. So not only is any demand from the York , PA landlord unsupportable, but the PA statute which might apply when someone dies, does not apply to their circumstances.
I hope the son in this matter tells them *not so nicely* to "go away"!
Section 250.303. Collection of rent in special cases
(2) The personal representative of a deceased landlord or deceased tenant for life who has demised the real property subject to his estate, or a deceased landlord whose real property has escheated to the Commonwealth,whether such rent accrued prior to or afterthe deathof the decedent and until the termination of the administration of the estate;
How does rent acrue after death if the lease terminated?
If there were someone else living with the deceased that was not a signee on the lease. For instance, a child living at home while attending college. Maybe mother dies and child still lives in apt for a few days or weeks after death to take care of things. That would make for additional rent payment that would have to be paid by the Estate of the person who died
Termination of the lease and termination of the administration of the estate mean two different things and if the statute doesn't apply to these circumstances , as newinscal posted, then what does apply?
EDT Death does not terminate a lease in Pennsylvania.
Last edited by virgode; 04-30-2010 at 11:39 AM..
Reason: edit
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