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Status:
"Let this year be over..."
(set 22 days ago)
Location: Where my bills arrive
19,219 posts, read 17,095,590 times
Reputation: 15538
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pantin23
(aso, my main point of choosing the median was to bring quicker travel times between the city and Shortpump (and not get caught up in too much of the west broad gridlock. Also, the LRT would run down the median, something which would drastically cut time, and not be running through anyone's property (I am not aware of whether or not the median is owned by private owners).
Also, Yes, I imagine there would have to be some moving of supports on bridges in some places (the obvious), as well as an elevated LRT section to get on and off of the highway.
Also, on the topic of Henrico, It is more the fact that I am Frustrated with the counties in general for their uncooperative history with the city (and I'll admit the name "Hellrico" is somewhat personal). Also, If the LRT accesses Short pump, I would actually see the county in support on this. Yes I am probably being too harsh on Henrico, and at least they aren't as uncompromisable as Chesterfield.
I didn't see where you had mentioned the median but unlike I195 it really isn't designed to have a transit corridor down the middle.
As for the cities relationship with the counties just a few thoughts:
1) Richmond is a corrupt, inept government and if their not, then they put on a great act. The city continues to demonstrate their inability to live within their financial means and manage their day to day activities.
2) The city jumps from one project to another never really completing one and usually not supporting that which they all ready have. How many years to get a new ball park? And the current plan seems to alienate everyone...
3) My Favorite editorial line, "You criticize the counties for not supporting the city base projects, but when has the city ever supported a project based in the counties?"
4) Richmond always assumes that they will be in charge, they will call the shots and the counties should follow their lead.
Why should Henrico support your plan? If there is a demand let GRTC fund the route on a trial basis and prove the demand. Why is it no is clamoring to get to Stony Point?
We are not in the 1950's anymore, Richmond or any city for that matter is not the center of the universe for a location. Suburban counties are communities themselves with not only the shopping but the jobs to support those that live there. Since being here 15+ years I have always got the feeling that the city is trying to recreated Broad Street the way is was back then, well it's gone. Even if Broad had stores that I wanted to go to why bother I have the same stores in the west end. What the city should do is create the shopping environments that supports those who live there.
Status:
"Let this year be over..."
(set 22 days ago)
Location: Where my bills arrive
19,219 posts, read 17,095,590 times
Reputation: 15538
Quote:
Originally Posted by AJNEOA
Well, I would think that Henrico would not necessarily be willing to let GRTC to run buses where they don't have an agreement (much more than just the bus would need to be delivered). And, of course, money is a huge part of it. At the end of the day, Henrico isn't interested in public transit (sans express buses), and that's fine. It just makes regional transportation planning difficult...
I wonder if the county would allow GRTC to test the waters on their own dime... I think the stumbling block is GRTC always has their hand out.
I actually would agree with most of what you say, but I would argue that we are not in the 1990s anymore, and the city has become more relevant again, as people are moving down there again. Also, clearly you have never seen the recent success of the Broad st arts district. Yes city efforts were a failure, in the form of 6th street marketplace, but that was over 25 years ago.
I wonder if the county would allow GRTC to test the waters on their own dime... I think the stumbling block is GRTC always has their hand out.
It's true that transit is subsidized, just like roads; and in the case of buses, it's both. Farebox recovery in Richmond will never be very good, so it will always need contributions from the localities it serves.
Regardless, I'm not sure why GRTC would serve a locality that doesn't contribute. That's the actual dynamic; you contribute and you get a subsidized service, or perhaps localities provide services for those they represent. The complicated factor is that GRTC can only be so successful in providing a service when they're limited to the city limits. Those that ride, and cannot afford a car, are stuck working, eating, going to doctor's offices, etc. all within that area. I suspect that Henrico may prefer it that way, but maybe that's not true...
Status:
"Let this year be over..."
(set 22 days ago)
Location: Where my bills arrive
19,219 posts, read 17,095,590 times
Reputation: 15538
/\
I don't know, posters keep saying that a route to SP is needed but Henrico doesn't seem to want it. GRTC needs to decide would it pay and try it, the line is owned by Richmond & Chesterfield so they could expand routes into that county, their not limited to the city.
Status:
"Let this year be over..."
(set 22 days ago)
Location: Where my bills arrive
19,219 posts, read 17,095,590 times
Reputation: 15538
Quote:
Originally Posted by pantin23
I actually would agree with most of what you say, but I would argue that we are not in the 1990s anymore, and the city has become more relevant again, as people are moving down there again. Also, clearly you have never seen the recent success of the Broad st arts district. Yes city efforts were a failure, in the form of 6th street marketplace, but that was over 25 years ago.
I'm glad people are choosing to make their lives in the city that's their choice. Having a vibrant arts scene fits in well but it doesn't provide stores and services people need to live in the city. Broad street downtown is not a desirable place and it seems most are going out of the city to take care of their shopping needs.
I made no mention of 6th Street Market, but like most projects they build it, ignore it then it falls apart. The city has too many layers of inefficient government and the people who live their pay for it. Your post had to do with light rail to Short Pump and I disagree that there is a need.
I'm glad people are choosing to make their lives in the city that's their choice. Having a vibrant arts scene fits in well but it doesn't provide stores and services people need to live in the city. Broad street downtown is not a desirable place and it seems most are going out of the city to take care of their shopping needs.
I made no mention of 6th Street Market, but like most projects they build it, ignore it then it falls apart. The city has too many layers of inefficient government and the people who live their pay for it. Your post had to do with light rail to Short Pump and I disagree that there is a need.
not in 2014, but I would imagine that by 2030 atmost, congestion will make it seem more practical
I didn't see where you had mentioned the median but unlike I195 it really isn't designed to have a transit corridor down the middle.
As for the cities relationship with the counties just a few thoughts:
1) Richmond is a corrupt, inept government and if their not, then they put on a great act. The city continues to demonstrate their inability to live within their financial means and manage their day to day activities.
2) The city jumps from one project to another never really completing one and usually not supporting that which they all ready have. How many years to get a new ball park? And the current plan seems to alienate everyone...
3) My Favorite editorial line, "You criticize the counties for not supporting the city base projects, but when has the city ever supported a project based in the counties?"
4) Richmond always assumes that they will be in charge, they will call the shots and the counties should follow their lead.
Why should Henrico support your plan? If there is a demand let GRTC fund the route on a trial basis and prove the demand. Why is it no is clamoring to get to Stony Point?
We are not in the 1950's anymore, Richmond or any city for that matter is not the center of the universe for a location. Suburban counties are communities themselves with not only the shopping but the jobs to support those that live there. Since being here 15+ years I have always got the feeling that the city is trying to recreated Broad Street the way is was back then, well it's gone. Even if Broad had stores that I wanted to go to why bother I have the same stores in the west end. What the city should do is create the shopping environments that supports those who live there.
Congestion. Short Pump is an auto oriented mess and it's only getting worse.
It would also make planning projects along a corridor easier since parking becomes less of an issue. You can go t a grocery store in a suburb, but you have to go downtown to experience downtown amenities.
Status:
"Let this year be over..."
(set 22 days ago)
Location: Where my bills arrive
19,219 posts, read 17,095,590 times
Reputation: 15538
Quote:
Originally Posted by Octa
Congestion. Short Pump is an auto oriented mess and it's only getting worse.
It would also make planning projects along a corridor easier since parking becomes less of an issue. You can go t a grocery store in a suburb, but you have to go downtown to experience downtown amenities.
I won't argue about short Pump, I rarely head that way but that's me. But this corridor you speak of, are you trying to alter the development patterns of Henrico or provide transport opportunities to city dwellers? If a light rail is a benefit to the city why does it avoid the more residential areas of the city? This is not NY or DC and I really don't see someone choosing to take the train in to go to dinner or a show, dressed up and having to walk several blocks from a station to their venue. I could see a benefit for those that go to the Bottom on the weekend (if the mayor doesn't destroy it) but would they really run trains through 1/2 in the morning... I doubt it.
How much do you use the busses now? Based on GRTC's continued removal of routes due to low attendance who are they serving....
I won't argue about short Pump, I rarely head that way but that's me. But this corridor you speak of, are you trying to alter the development patterns of Henrico or provide transport opportunities to city dwellers? If a light rail is a benefit to the city why does it avoid the more residential areas of the city? This is not NY or DC and I really don't see someone choosing to take the train in to go to dinner or a show, dressed up and having to walk several blocks from a station to their venue. I could see a benefit for those that go to the Bottom on the weekend (if the mayor doesn't destroy it) but would they really run trains through 1/2 in the morning... I doubt it.
How much do you use the busses now? Based on GRTC's continued removal of routes due to low attendance who are they serving....
I would break GRTC's riders into three categories:
1. Low Socioeconomic riders - The poor are by and far the largest number of riders for GRTC.
2. Middle/Upper Middle class local riders - Those from places like the Fan, Museum, Bellevue and other neighborhoods where connectivity to job centers downtown are fairly convenient.
3. Burb to city commuters (express buses) - Those working for the government, law offices, etc. downtown, but live outside the city and don't want to drive or pay for parking.
I think it would be reasonable to run BRT down broad (NOT 64, as there's no connectivity to anything there), but it would still require a lot of investment by Henrico. There's missing infrastructure that would be required. I also agree with you that a LARGE majority of those living in Henrico would not be willing to walk out the front door to go to work on BRT or to go to dinner and a show via PT. Even with infrastructure investment, 99% of those that live in the burbs still could not walk from their homes. They'd have to have parking; and with low highway congestion (outside rush hour), most would not choose to do so IMO.
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