Why public high schools rated poorly? (Sandy, Clinton: house, neighborhood, school districts)

[tienshanman]

I am considering SLC versus Boulder, CO. However, I have noticed that the Greatschools site rates the best SLC high school (West HS) at a mere 5 out of 10. Boulder's two HSs on the other hand rate 10 and 9. Why do SLC high schools and other public schools in general rate so poorly??

[mattsk42]

Also curious on this, but I'm guessing it's partially due to the high student to teacher ratio. Look at what stats are actually being taken to get this rating, a LOT of these are very misleading. Also, look at individual districts' salary schedule to figure out pay. Some of these education things take into account salary of ALL teachers, preschool to college, which skews what an actual high school teacher actually makes.

[Geo-Aggie]

I wouldn't pay much attention to the greatschools ratings, because first of all West is far from the best high school in the SLC area. In fact, I'd say it's one of the lesser ones. It also rates the elementary school near my house as a 2, out of 10. However it's just a typical elementary school with typical students who achieve pretty well and I'm sure will have a higher percentage of students who go on to university in 8 years than an average elementary school.

The reason for the poor ratings isn't that they're actually BAD, it's the funding and class sizes and the fact that greatschools likely uses an algorithm to rate schools.

Utah schools are pathetically funded. Everyone here has larger families and send a bazillion kids to public schools, but pay a similar amount in taxes as families in Vermont with 1-2 kids. This causes crowded classrooms. My elementary school classes were typically 28-32 kids. I give presentations on geology to 4th graders about once a month and I'd say class sizes have remained the same since I was that age, 18 years ago.

That being said, Salt Lake is not Boulder. The ideologies of the two towns are very different and you should consider that before deciding where to move. One is a fairly moderate city in a sea of ultra-conservative bedroom communities and the other is an ultra liberal moderately sized suburban college town suburb of a larger city.

[jeanjeanvaljean]

Originally Posted by Geo-Aggie

I wouldn't pay much attention to the greatschools ratings, because first of all West is far from the best high school in the SLC area. In fact, I'd say it's one of the lesser ones. It also rates the elementary school near my house as a 2, out of 10. However it's just a typical elementary school with typical students who achieve pretty well and I'm sure will have a higher percentage of students who go on to university in 8 years than an average elementary school.

The reason for the poor ratings isn't that they're actually BAD, it's the funding and class sizes and the fact that greatschools likely uses an algorithm to rate schools.

Utah schools are pathetically funded. Everyone here has larger families and send a bazillion kids to public schools, but pay a similar amount in taxes as families in Vermont with 1-2 kids. This causes crowded classrooms. My elementary school classes were typically 28-32 kids. I give presentations on geology to 4th graders about once a month and I'd say class sizes have remained the same since I was that age, 18 years ago.

That being said, Salt Lake is not Boulder. The ideologies of the two towns are very different and you should consider that before deciding where to move. One is a fairly moderate city in a sea of ultra-conservative bedroom communities and the other is an ultra liberal moderately sized suburban college town suburb of a larger city.

I'm not positive that what you're saying is true - greatschools.org looks at things like test scores, etc.

There have been over 80 viewings of the original post. Does nobody have anything to say? My husband and I are returning to SLC (Sandy, techically, in Canyons School District) and - after our 6 year absence - will be bringing two children. The quality of high schools is a big concern. Why the low rankings, why the low scores?

Please, can someone discuss this with actual information, no anecdotes?

[kletter1mann]

Originally Posted by jeanjeanvaljean

I'm not positive that what you're saying is true - greatschools.org looks at things like test scores, etc.

There have been over 80 viewings of the original post. Does nobody have anything to say? My husband and I are returning to SLC (Sandy, techically, in Canyons School District) and - after our 6 year absence - will be bringing two children. The quality of high schools is a big concern. Why the low rankings, why the low scores?

Please, can someone discuss this with actual information, no anecdotes?

Because this particular forum is surprisingly unreflective. There is rarely serious discussion on real issues that might reflect poorly on Utah. Nobody wants to touch it. The primary exceptions are debate on the winter inversions and various issues on fitting in to the LDS culture. And even those tend to subtly place blame on the newcomer, not question the culture itself. It's mostly about which-neighborhood-will-work-for-me. But any deeper than that.... well, not so much.

[WyoNewk]

Originally Posted by Geo-Aggie

My elementary school classes were typically 28-32 kids. I give presentations on geology to 4th graders about once a month and I'd say class sizes have remained the same since I was that age, 18 years ago.

If that's true, that's a pretty pathetic ratio. It was that way when I was in high school too, but I thought school boards were doing better these days. In Wyoming, classes are limited by law to 16 students per teacher except in certain circumstances or when waived by the state. Wyoming also pays its teachers more than any bordering state, and that's provided an ample supply of good teachers eager to fill new/vacated slots. That wasn't true even 15 years ago. I give our legislature kudos for taking secondary education seriously.

[11thHour]

I'd say it's because they are underfunded for the number of students. The problem is many here have unusually large families, and they send their kids to the public schools. But, they aren't fully funding their own kids' education as they are actually getting tax exemptions for them! So what ends up happening is those with a small number of kids or no kids at all are footing the bill for these people in addition to paying for their own kids. I don't mind paying my fair share even though I don't have kids, as a better educated populace benefits all. But, I do not like those who have large families using exemptions to not cover their own kids cost. It's a pipe dream, but I'd love to see dependent exemptions axed completely.

[tuffpirate]

I live in Utah and I wish someone could answer this for me.

It doesn't make sense--an area will have like 6 nicely-rated elementaries and then one horribly rated high school.

Highland High gets terrible ratings, but the elementaries in the area are ok. What gives?

[SWFL_Native]

I love that the funding of schools in Utah is low. Coming from upstate NY their schools are swimming with cash and have a shrinking student base as nobody wants to live there due to weather and high taxes. Every other day the news is covering some school district meeting where the parents are all rabbled up over meaningless "under funding". They couldn't balance a budget to save their lives!

I'd much prefer to keep our taxes low than feed the waste machine that school districts become.

[dcisive]

I would say 11thhour nailed it nicely. Along with the fact it would be nice if Senior Citizens (those that either haven't had children in the schools system for at least a generation or more as well as those that never had children in it in the first place) should receive that exemption. Fair is fair. If you have em be responsible for raising and supporting them. It's a really simple concept that people like some here and Mrs. Clinton(of who I'd LOVE to stick that "it takes a village" and place it where the sun don't shine) seem to think is off base. Any other viewpoint is pure Socialism at it's finiest, a method I would prefer to NOT live under. It's also not what this country was founded on either