Low-Cost San Diego Alternatives (San Francisco, Columbia: low income, real estate, how much)

[USDefault]

Am interested in whether people have considered or found a U.S. locale with a low cost of living, a place to call home that has some San Diego attributes -- especially one that is outside California, but am interested in all thoughts. Key considerations are good weather, low or reasonably priced homes, no or low income tax, low property taxes.

We are a dual-income no-kid couple, hence there are some things we don't have to worry about, like schools and colleges. Don't care if the local schools are the worst in the nation. Family friendly? Don't care. Have to travel to get to things? Fine with us, no attachments or responsibilities. We are lasered on low cost nice homes, low taxes and fees, and decent weather.

I'll list a couple of places we have thought about. Austin, Texas: obvious choice because the job market is pretty good and cost-of-living is much, much lower, no income tax. But the summers are pretty damned hot (been to Dallas and Houston many times during summer, it's pretty bad). Not very San Diego-like during the summer. Vancouver Washington: been there, it is really nice, great reasonably-priced homes with large green properties. You can even get a nice home right on the Columbia River for a lot less than San Diego and they look great. No income tax. Downside is the winters, not much snow, but it gets into the 30s during the winter months, so not very San Diego-like during the winter. Though Vancouver is awesome during the spring, summer and fall. Salt Lake City, Utah: amazing natural beauty, very affordable homes, pretty good job market. But look deeper, SLC has a burgeoning pollution problem, especially with the "inversion" which causes particulates to build up and hang in their atmosphere. SLC residents now regularly complaining during the winter they literally having breathing problems because the pollution is a thick haze blanketing the county. No thanks.

If you've considered this, what conclusions have you made?

[earlyretirement]

Originally Posted by USDefault

Am interested in whether people have considered or found a U.S. locale with a low cost of living, a place to call home that has some San Diego attributes -- especially one that is outside California, but am interested in all thoughts. Key considerations are good weather, low or reasonably priced homes, no or low income tax, low property taxes.

We are a dual-income no-kid couple, hence there are some things we don't have to worry about, like schools and colleges. Don't care if the local schools are the worst in the nation. Family friendly? Don't care. Have to travel to get to things? Fine with us, no attachments or responsibilities. We are lasered on low cost nice homes, low taxes and fees, and decent weather.

I'll list a couple of places we have thought about. Austin, Texas: obvious choice because the job market is pretty good and cost-of-living is much, much lower, no income tax. But the summers are pretty damned hot (been to Dallas and Houston many times during summer, it's pretty bad). Not very San Diego-like during the summer. Vancouver Washington: been there, it is really nice, great reasonably-priced homes with large green properties. You can even get a nice home right on the Columbia River for a lot less than San Diego and they look great. No income tax. Downside is the winters, not much snow, but it gets into the 30s during the winter months, so not very San Diego-like during the winter. Though Vancouver is awesome during the spring, summer and fall. Salt Lake City, Utah: amazing natural beauty, very affordable homes, pretty good job market. But look deeper, SLC has a burgeoning pollution problem, especially with the "inversion" which causes particulates to build up and hang in their atmosphere. SLC residents now regularly complaining during the winter they literally having breathing problems because the pollution is a thick haze blanketing the county. No thanks.

If you've considered this, what conclusions have you made?

Well, all these places are drastically different. San Diego, Austin, Vancouver, SLC. I've visited all of these cities but don't know specifics as well as I know Austin (Texas) specifics.

No way I'd say summers in Austin would be comfortable. A few summers ago they had something like 40 days of 100 degree weather pretty much with the rest of Texas. The summers are just brutal in most of Texas. Also, the no State income taxes is nice but they rape you with property tax rates. I've posted this before but I'll post again that some areas can get as high as 3% per year in property taxes.

Yes, real estate is MUCH cheaper there but if you have a nice place that 2.5% to 3% annual property taxes can add up. Also, the electricity bills can REALLY kill you if you have a big house. It's not uncommon for some of my friends to have electricity bills during the summer in their homes over $1,000 per month. And I myself had a house in Dallas and had massive electricity bills and I lived alone in a big house!

None of these cities can compare with how great San Diego is. But also real estate in San Diego is fairly expensive as you know.

There are very few states that don't have State income taxes and I don't particularly find most of them too desirable. It sounds like it will really become an issue of just how important that no State income tax will be. I look at it as sort of a "bribe" that states pay to help get people to get them to live there. LOL.

[cruitr]

Please describe your "low cost nice homes": price, size etc.

[earlyretirement]

Originally Posted by cruitr

Please describe your "low cost nice homes": price, size etc.

Yeah and even better if you can post some URL examples for frame of reference.

[shmoov_groovzsd]

Curious what constitutes as 'good' weather in your eyes? I don't know many cities in which folks move to for the great weather as much as San Diego.
In sunbelt type cities, you might get a few months of mild weather and then have to deal with extremes on one end or another. Whereas maybe a place like Coeur D'Alene Idaho has mild summers and winters that are not too extreme on average.

Quite frankly, an alternative to SD would not cover all bases on your list. If there was, I am certain it would not be cheap to live there either.

[earlyretirement]

Originally Posted by shmoov_groovzsd

Curious what constitutes as 'good' weather' in your eyes? .

LOL. You know I was thinking the same thing! When I hear "good weather" I think of San Diego. Not sweltering 100+ days for months at a time in the summer or cold or gloomy days in the winter.

I guess it's all relative.

It sounds like to me tax exposure is the more important element that the OP is looking for and not really "weather".

But even on the lower cost real estate areas, like I mentioned, you can get hit hard. My buddy in Dallas lives in a nice area. His place is only a townhouse and fairly small and is about half the value of my house (and about a third of the size of my place) in San Diego and he the same property tax that I pay in San Diego. The best thing is we have Prop 13 protecting our upside property tax exposure. He doesn't.

You have to look at the complete big picture. He also spends at least double on his utility bills vs. me.

[Think4Yourself]

Ahh, yet another poster who wants the sun, the moon, and the stars but who doesn't want to pay for them. Guess what? Land in nice places costs money. If there was a place as nice as San Diego it wouldn't stay cheap long because everyone would move there so you can either have a cheap but crappy place or you can have a nice but expensive place. This is the nature of supply & demand.

If you want a place with perfect year round weather, a good economy, and a plenty of natural scenic beauty then California is just about the only place you'll find it on this continent and the land is priced accordingly.

[Think4Yourself]

BTW unless you make more than $250,000 per year you won't be paying much in the state income tax especially with deductions and exemptions. If you make $30k per year your total cost would be ~$450 before deductions while if you make $100,000 per year your total cost would be ~$5500 before deductions which can result in lowering it substantially. I don't know how much income you make but unless it is exceptionally high your whining about state income taxes doesn't make a lot of sense especially since simply paying the higher cost of utilities in a place like Texas will amount to a much, much, much larger expense.

[Fran66]

"Key considerations are good weather, low or reasonably priced homes, no or low income tax, low property taxes."

I gather you live in San Diego now? You don't really say. And if you live in San Diego, you don't say how long you've lived there.

Without that information, and perhaps regardless, my thoughts are: I've lived all over The US (not always by choice) in the past 64 years, and the only places I have found great to live in are San Diego and San Francisco. There is always something to do, and you can do it, because year-round the weather is good.

Yes, there are lots of things not great about San Diego -- and certainly CA taxes are one of them -- but the pros outweight the cons, by a long shot, IMHO.

Seven years ago I retired and moved out of Southern CA. In October of this year, I'm moving back to San Diego. And I can hardly wait.

PS: I totally agree with Think4Yourself.

[Think4Yourself]

The good news about California is that the property tax rate is half what it is in Texas, the weather is just about the best in the country so you don't have to run the heater or the AC much, and I find the homes to be reasonably priced given what a wonderful place San Diego is. It's up to the OP to decide if that mountain of good things justifies the few bad things but I guess it all depends on if he has the money or not.