Are You Really Sure You Want To Move SF? (San Francisco: lease, how much)

[HockeyMac18]

Originally Posted by NextStage

The funny thing to me is that I'm guessing the majority of posters in this forum and in the Bay area in general aren't so easily categorized and probably don't fit into ANY of those groups.

It's much easier to despise and deride a group or category than it is to really get to know individuals. Takes a lot more work though.

Is it any surprise? Take a look at our political discourse today...it's atrocious. Everyone seems to have to belong to some "group" - and it's common rhetoric now to assume things about other people's beliefs or to group whole swaths of individuals into pre-defined bins.

We've gotten to a point where people's arguments are basically "well, you're a part of THAT group...I'm not going to listen a thing you say"...basically, labels have become pejoratives meant as insults.


Unfortunately for these people, the world is not that simple - not everything is not black and white. Democrat vs. Republican...me vs. them...


It's all rather embarrassing, if I'm honest.

[sav858]

Originally Posted by NextStage

The funny thing to me is that I'm guessing the majority of posters in this forum and in the Bay area in general aren't so easily categorized and probably don't fit into ANY of those groups.

It's much easier to despise and deride a group or category than it is to really get to know individuals. Takes a lot more work though.

Eh you get used to it. I don't really know or associate with anyone like all the stereotypes described on here. I know those stereotypes exist for a reason, I just figure people are describing other people found in a rather small, transplant heavy area (SF-Oak-Berkeley) and don't realize most of the area is filled with rather average people. The Bay Area I live in and people I encounter and associate with is far different than what is described on here.

[john-staten island]

Originally Posted by I Have a Building Fetish

^GTFO, we didn't ask for a New Yorker's opinion rating on California. And as for LA, don't worry, we know you were overwhelmed by its massive neverending sprawling size that makes New York look tiny.

"Nothing compares to NYC", umm i think you meant nothing compares to Manhattan, because really anything outside that island isn't any that special really. People only fly to New York State for that one borough where as people fly to California for its mountains, beaches, AND world class cities. Staten Island and Queens are just "anywhere else USA".

Listen newby with 27 posts, be civil or take a hike. Clowns like you ruin this forum.

[mysticaltyger]

Originally Posted by HockeyMac18

Is it any surprise? Take a look at our political discourse today...it's atrocious. Everyone seems to have to belong to some "group" - and it's common rhetoric now to assume things about other people's beliefs or to group whole swaths of individuals into pre-defined bins.

We've gotten to a point where people's arguments are basically "well, you're a part of THAT group...I'm not going to listen a thing you say"...basically, labels have become pejoratives meant as insults.


Unfortunately for these people, the world is not that simple - not everything is not black and white. Democrat vs. Republican...me vs. them...


It's all rather embarrassing, if I'm honest.

What you're describing are the basic "divide & rule" tactics used to keep a population under the control of the elite. As long as they can get us to stereotype each other and be divided each other, we can be ruled over by an elite much smaller than the 1%.

[bmw335xi]

Originally Posted by mysticaltyger

What you're describing are the basic "divide & rule" tactics used to keep a population under the control of the elite. As long as they can get us to stereotype each other and be divided each other, we can be ruled over by an elite much smaller than the 1%.

Exactly, too bad most people are too blind to notice.

[CaliRestoration]

Originally Posted by Perma Bear

Where do the metrosexual hipster techie transplants fit into this?

They are a mix of SJW Libs and City Lovers.

[ctr88]

OP is right on. SF=big time overrated. Went to college there and lived in SF Bay for 18 yrs. Can't believe people pay all that money for the crap shacks they live and horrible traffic. SF is a fake artificial city now full of tech hipsters. There are few families, working class, and age diversification real cities have. Seattle and Portland are following where SF has gone into being fake cities too.. I think some of the more UNDER rated cities these days are in the Midwest and East coast.

[Misosoba]

TL;DR SF is an overpriced, over hyped city as seen by a young business/engineering professional from LA.

I've been a long time lurker but finally decided to register just to reply to this thread. My opinions and experiences are coming through from a particular POV so I don't expect folks to entirely agree/understand. In no particular order, here's my 2 cents:

1. As a native Angelino for 20+ years and now working in SF in tech, I agree with OP (although some points seem a bit exaggerated). As recent as in 2014, I'd visit SF several times/yr when it became too hot in LA and always thought it was a wonderful city. My opinion took a 180 when I moved here for a tech startup. It seems I never stayed long enough before to see the other side of SF. Now I'm looking for ways to move back to LA without losing out on my current income.

2. Cost of living sucks in SF! The rent for my 500sqft 1 bedroom "luxury" apartment is more than the mortgage for my 1,500 sqft 3bd/2br in LA. The definition of "luxury" in SF apparently is "not built before the 90s". It's not just the real estate but everything else is proportionately more expensive. Groceries, gasoline, utilities, etc... is roughly 10-20% higher than in LA. If you're coming from cities with lower COL, be prepared for sticker shock. Even coming from LA, I always felt bamboozled one way or another. Imagine paying $5 for a beer in one bar and then going to another, smaller bar paying $10 for the same beer. Just because I can afford it doesn't mean I'm willing to pay for it. Driving outside the city, there are still empty plots of land where developers refuse to build additional housing. They're content charging us up the a$$ for rent.

3. It's a dirty, dirty city. Although I live in a relatively nice building in SoMa, there is a fleet of homeless people within 5-10 minutes walking in all directions. Go north past Chinatown? Homeless. Go west past all the shopping on Market? Homeless. Go South past Yerba Buena? You guessed it right, homeless! Occasionally I'd find bearded gentlemen urinating/defecating and lovely ladies offering "services" right outside the lobby. What kills me is everyone is so jaded that they walk by like it's normal. The homeless are generally everywhere in SF. Before someone comments about other neighborhoods in SF, please pick a point and trace out half a mile in all directions and tell me that area doesn't have homeless people.

4. Weather in SF is not the most ideal. It's great compared to most places outside CA but the summers are terrible. If you disagree with this, please visit any SoCal beach during the summer and you'd understand. To date I've yet to stay at a beach in SF longer than 30 minutes, let alone bathe in the water.

5. People in SF are mediocre to the extent that warrants the "meh" reaction. Women in SF tend to be lower on the genetic lottery scale compared to LA. Want to be around beautiful women? Go to LA or SD. The same can be said about men. As a straight male, I can confidently confirm there are more handsome men in LA. Literally, the good looking people flock to LA to pursue a career in Hollywood so there is a higher concentration. My opinion may be biased because I work in tech but it seems almost everyone I meet in SF works in tech or has a spouse/partner that works in tech. This leads to very dull conversations. The glitz and glamour party scene is non-existent but there are a number of good dive bars. Don't expect to find women at bars though. There's a reason why they call it Man Jose, Manta Clara, Mantain View, etc... There are also a lot of comicon/anime/cosplay typed people here. This statement speaks for itself. The protests from Oakland often spill over to SF to the point where it's unsafe to be outside when it occurs. I've been locked in twice so far, once at a restaurant near Union Square because of the Black Lives Matter protest and recently at a Starbucks on Market due to the anti-Trump rallies. There's also this gem: Black Lives Matters Demonstrators Block All Westbound Bay Bridge Lanes « CBS San Francisco

6. The culinary experience is a little disappointing. I agree with what was said previously about SF being a great choice for fine dining but not everyone can afford to blow $300/person for dinner regularly. I applaud SF for the number of Michelin rated restaurants but great ground level eateries are lacking. I'll take tacos and AYCE Korean BBQ over Gary Danko, French Laundry, or Kusakabe any day.

7. Traffic in SF is much worse than in LA. The people who think LA traffic sucks have obviously never heard of Waze or lived there long enough to learn the traffic patterns. Yes there are a ton of cars in LA but there are more freeways that are at least 4+ lanes on both sides. There are long sections of the 101 & 880 here that are 3 lanes on each side! Traffic on SF bridges is the worst I've seen ever experienced in the US (and don't get me started bout the bridge tolls and the atrocious lines at the toll booths). The difference is LA is slow because of the quantity of cars while SF is slow because of the poor infrastructure. An accident in SF halts the infrastructure while in LA you simply re-route to another freeway. BART is much more of a dump than Metro in LA. I once witnessed a (probably homeless) guy eating raw chicken on the BART. As a driver, cyclists are rude and as a cyclist, cars try to run you over. In LA they at least realize this and refuse to paint more bike lanes.

8. Sports fans in the Bay are nuts. I thought Dodgers fans were terrible but I never felt unsafe going to a game in LA. Here, if you don't support the local teams, you are against them.

[kabess]

I just moved here from the Netherlands 2 months ago. And couldn't agree more with the opening post. What a disappointment.
Silicon Valley must be the most boring place on earth. SF is a little better, but expensive, filthy, cold and filled with hipsters and ugly girls. Normally had to stay till May, but I'll try to go back sooner.

[Perma Bear]

Originally Posted by kabess

I just moved here from the Netherlands 2 months ago. And couldn't agree more with the opening post. What a disappointment.
Silicon Valley must be the most boring place on earth. SF is a little better, but expensive, filthy, cold and filled with hipsters and ugly girls. Normally had to stay till May, but I'll try to go back sooner.

You're free to go back and never return like all transplants should if they're happy or not.